@sonship saidAre you really serious that you would suggest that I need sympathy from you, or your prayers for that matter? I need neither. Keep them to yourself.
@SecondSonToo bad Rajk stopped learning at the law.
You know sometimes after prayer, I come to this board with a real sympathetic heart towards just about everyone.
Let's see how long it lasts today. lol.
Now, this fellow, as belligerent as he can be, sometimes invokes my sympathy. Sympathy which he probably would not appreciate.
But he just ha ...[text shortened]... b] ?
Died to the law.
Died to the law that he might live to God.
What is this ?
As for your Gal 3:19 quote you clearly do not understand what you read. You try to take every passage and twist it. Paul is saying, having been a Jew who persecuted followers of Christ, because of the teachings of the Law of Moses, now he finally understands that the law of Christ has superceded the Law of Moses. Now he is giving up the Law of Moses and living for Christ/God.
This entails following the commandments of Christ and living righteously. Paul in the subsequent chapters drives this point home .. ie THAT RIGHTEOUSNESS IS REQUIRED OF ALL CHIRSTIAN SAINTS BEFORE THEY CAN INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD.
This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. (Galatians 5:16-21 KJV)
Read the whole book of Galatians and stop your stupid cherrypicking
Are you really serious that you would suggest that I need sympathy from you, or your prayers for that matter? I need neither. Keep them to yourself.
On the contrary. I suspected AND WROTE that you would probably not appreciate any sympathy from me.
And as EXPECTED you snort at the very idea of you needing any from me.
But this was my comment for another poster in public.
It was not written so that you could read it. That you read it is COINCIDENTAL because I saw no need to write it in private.
I was talking to SecondSon.
Read the whole book of Galatians and stop your stupid cherrypicking
What am I "cherrypicking" ?
When I highlight passages that emphasize the assurance of eternal redemption, you say that is "cherrypicking" ?
If so WHY should that cherry NOT be picked ?
What is about the verses on the assurance of salvation which makes them CHERRIES which SHOULD NOT BE PICKED ?
The righteousness that Paul's longs to live is one by FAITH. That is FAITH that Christ can be everything in him, for him, that Pauls needs. The "bountiful supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ" .
You know what I think? I think you didn't talk much about walking by the Spirit until you debated with me and realized how lopsided your concept of keep the commandments of Jesus was. I think you learned something from me.
Anyway the thought of me "cherrypicking" Galatians 3:19 is rather stupid. The entire cherry tree is delicious and to be feasted on.
@sonship saidYour Lee inspired question, 'What more did God want or need?' simply highlights how far you have strayed from the Christian understanding of God as a complete being who needs nothing from us.
@Ghost-of-a-Duke
Some progress. At least Ghost nods timidly toward the existence of God.
Some progress from atheism, don't you think?
Your Lee inspired question, 'What more did God want or need?' simply highlights how far you have strayed from the Christian understanding of God as a complete being who needs nothing from us.
I thought your quote from Tozer was good. But it is not the whole matter as if nothing else to be said.
The Bible concludes with a MARRIAGE. God as the Redeemer Who has become incarnated as a man, enjoys an eternal MARRIAGE LIFE with a collective city.
Now if human beings cannot identify the pleasure and happiness of being married they can see that God goes so far in the revelation to touch our hearts with His desire.
Philosophically, whether or not God NEEDS in the same sense, we might debate. Surely He WANTS something and will not take no for an answer.
Well now I am a typical human being. And the day of my marriage was probably the second happiest day of my whole life. You may argue "Well you didn't NEED her. You had NO NEED. You were complete, whole, self sufficient, self satisfied without your spouse, your Mrs. on that day."
No, that's not me. And God has communicated to the world what it is like for Him to consummate His eternal purpose. Do you understand, O man, that it is a MARRIAGE ?
"And I saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband." (Rev. 21:2)
So I take Tozer's insight there as good but not the whole story.
IF God were completely alone maybe He would have no need.
Maybe as soon as God creates OTHER beings, God has a need.
It is mysterious.
But the Bible closes with two great revelations.
1.) God's redeemed people become a HOUSE for Him to live in.
2.) God's redeemed become a collective SPOUSE for Him to enjoy an eternal romantic married life with.
Plenty of verses in the Bible show God needing His will to be completely accomplished. And He will not take no for an answer no matter the obstacles that are erected against His will.
If for eternity God created no one else, maybe God would have no need.
As soon as God creates other lives, He appears to need something.
He needs are as great as His unlimited Being. He must have His eternal purpose fulfilled.
The universe was created FOR the fulfillment of His purpose. He had a plan first. Then He created all things for the sake of fulfilling that plan, that good pleasure of His will.
Predestinating us unto sonship through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will." (Eph. 1:5)
It says also that He chose some in Christ "before the foundation of the world" (v.4a) That must mean that first God made a choice to HAVE something. Then based on that desire He went on the lay the foundation of the world, that is to create the universe.
The universe was created FOR His will.
"You are worthy, our Lord and God, to receive the glory and the honor and the power, for You have created all things, and because of Your will they were, and were created." (Rev. 5:11)
@sonship saidIt is simply illogical that a holy, eternal, almighty, and totally self-sufficient deity would want or need anything from His creation.
If for eternity God created no one else, maybe God would have no need.
As soon as God creates other lives, He appears to need something.
He needs are as great as His unlimited Being. He must have His eternal purpose fulfilled.
The universe was created FOR the fulfillment of His purpose. He had a plan first. Then He created all things for the sake of fulfilling that ...[text shortened]... ted all things, and because of Your will they were, and were created." (Rev. 5:11) [/quote]
It is simply illogical that a holy, eternal, almighty, and totally self-sufficient deity would want or need anything from His creation.
That's more like Islam.
If God needed nothing it is strange why Jesus Christ went through all He did that His Father's will would be done AT ANY COST.
Why did He not just say in the garden of Gethsemane " I will just forgo this crucifixion Father. After all You really need NOTHING from anyone." ?
@sonship saidI think you are conflating 'need' for 'want.'
@Ghost-of-a-DukeIt is simply illogical that a holy, eternal, almighty, and totally self-sufficient deity would want or need anything from His creation.
That's more like Islam.
If God needed nothing it is strange why Jesus Christ went through all He did that His Father's will would be done AT ANY COST.
Why did He not just say in the garden o ...[text shortened]... ane " I will just forgo this crucifixion Father. After all You really need NOTHING from anyone." ?
A completely self-sufficient deity 'needs' nothing. - However, an omnibenevolent deity could be said to 'want' the best for his creation, purely out of love. That is Christianity sir, not Islam or Lee.
@Ghost-of-a-Duke
Just a suggestion. IF you want to keep mentioning Lee how about reading one book from Lee all the way through?
If you're going to constantly posture as an expert on Witness Lee, read a book.
What you say about need could easily be transferred to the word "want". Like, God doesn't WANT anything because He is completely self existing and self sufficient.
Now I go by the statements of the Bible primarily.
It seems like you want to go by creedal axioms so that theological creeds remain intact. .
Ie. "We must remember divine omnipotence."
Well, we can remember that but we also must remember what the Bible said.
"... according to the good pleasure of His will"
A completely self-sufficient deity 'needs' nothing. - However, an omnibenevolent deity could be said to 'want' the best for his creation, purely out of love. That is Christianity sir, not Islam or Lee.
Did you answer my question about the Lord in the garden of Gethsemane?
He sweat drops of blood in strong petitioning. I take it as absolutely petitioning for me personally and you personally. God become a man can do this. That is the finite man united with the infinite God can do this apparently.
He had a need to go through being the sin offering that you might be saved, justified, forgiven. You say He had no need. Why didn't He refuse the horror of receiving that divine judgment from God and torture from men by just reminding the Father that God has no need ?