hail obama, obama hitler?????

Originally posted by Badwater
If Jesus rose from the dead all other faiths are nothing? NOT. That kind of exclusionary drivel is dangerous in thought and deadly in practice. Other faiths have the right to their expression regardless of whether the resurrection happened or not. They have the right, and it can be correct - there can be more than one right point of view.

The perspective h God is open to all. Open to all. Even those who don't believe that Jesus rose from the dead.

"Open to all. Even those who don't believe that Jesus rose from the dead."

Not so! The death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ is central to the Christian faith. It is the object of "The Faith", and without belief in it, one is excluded from having the relationship with God necessary for inclusion in the family of God.

Without a relationship with God, based solely on what God has done to establish that relationship, i.e. Jesus, and what He, Jesus, did at the cross, one is left to his own devices, i.e. religion, in the hope of establishing a relationship with God based on his own efforts.

Can you see the difference?

Originally posted by josephw
[b]"Open to all. Even those who don't believe that Jesus rose from the dead."

Not so! The death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ is central to the Christian faith. It is the object of "The Faith", and without belief in it, one is excluded from having the relationship with God necessary for inclusion in the family of God.

Without a relation ...[text shortened]... tablishing a relationship with God based on his own efforts.

Can you see the difference?[/b]

Wrong. You are completely wrong and I've explained why. It's people like you that have justified evils such as the Crusades, evils like the Salem Witch trials, evils like declaring war in God's name. Not only are you wrong, you are part of the problem.

Jesus did not teach that belief in his resurrection was the way to God. In none of his parables is his death involved. He did not teach his disciples that all they had to do was believe in his resurrection and they are doing His works. No no no.

This silliness may be central to your faith and if so, good for you. If that's all that you're getting from Jesus of Nazareth then you are spiritually an infant and will remain a blind neophyte, clamoring and clinging to a weak premise that lacks any spiritual depth. What Jesus would offer is so much more than that, but if that's all you're willing to take in then it's you that suffers. People like me will watch and make sure you're not inflicting that shallow, myopic filth on others who also have legitimate beliefs that are different, and all the backing and authority that you have. Or not, as it were.

Originally posted by Badwater
Wrong. You are completely wrong and I've explained why. It's people like you that have justified evils such as the Crusades, evils like the Salem Witch trials, evils like declaring war in God's name. Not only are you wrong, you are part of the problem.

Jesus did not teach that belief in his resurrection was the way to God. In none of his parables is his ...[text shortened]... hat are different, and all the backing and authority that you have. Or not, as it were.

"It's people like you that have justified evils such as the Crusades,"

You see! This is exactly what's wrong with your judgement in these matters. I have never, nor will I ever, try to justify the Crusades or any other historical event that results in the unjustified death of anyone.

And just what does the Crusades have to do with "True Christianity" anyway? Why open that can of worms to try to support your position? Do you honestly think the Muslims of that era were innocent of atrocities committed against humanity? Don't be absurd!

Anyone can isolate specific events to justify thier position, but that doesn't make the case. There are no innocent by-standers in this world. There isn't a people group or religious organization that doesn't have dirty hands.

"Jesus did not teach that belief in his resurrection was the way to God."

This is where you prove that debating about what the Bible teaches, with you, is pointless.

Jesus did indeed try to tell His disciples that He would suffer and die, but they refused to believe it. The fact that the Messiah would be crucified was clearly described in the old testament. The full meaning and importance of the crucifiction and resurrection of Jesus was given later to the Apostle Paul.

It appears that you don't really know the contents of the Bible.

Originally posted by josephw
[b]"It's people like you that have justified evils such as the Crusades,"

You see! This is exactly what's wrong with your judgement in these matters. I have never, nor will I ever, try to justify the Crusades or any other historical event that results in the unjustified death of anyone.

And just what does the Crusades have to do with "True Christia ...[text shortened]... Apostle Paul.

It appears that you don't really know the contents of the Bible.[/b]

But Jesus didn't die, he wasn't 'resurected', he was hidden out long enough to get better and make a brief appearance and then split up the silk route, establishing monasteries along the way and dying in Kashmir. That is the reality of it. You don't soak people with Aloe thinking it is an embalming fluid.

Originally posted by sonhouse
But Jesus didn't die, he wasn't 'resurected', he was hidden out long enough to get better and make a brief appearance and then split up the silk route, establishing monasteries along the way and dying in Kashmir. That is the reality of it. You don't soak people with Aloe thinking it is an embalming fluid.

The world is obiviously full of people that are full of it, and you just happen to be one of them.

By the time you get done rewriting history nobody will know for sure just what happened. 🙄

Originally posted by josephw

"Jesus did not teach that belief in his resurrection was the way to God."

...

Jesus did indeed try to tell His disciples that He would suffer and die, but they refused to believe it. The fact that the Messiah would be crucified was clearly described in the old testament. The full meaning and importance of the crucifiction and resurrection of Jes ...[text shortened]... ter to the Apostle Paul.

It appears that you don't really know the contents of the Bible.[/b]

I would ask you to provide context to support your assertions, but you'd screw it up. I can read the Bible just fine, thank you; and furthermore, the context in which Jesus is foretelling his death is a means of preparing his disciples to carry on his teachings, not instructing them that from his death on they only need acknowledge his resurrection as their only and most important tenet of their faith.

This is a classic instance of where I get more reading what athiests posts here than I do from most plenary believers. Really, some of the garbage that is posted by "Christians" is truly appalling.

I get a huge laugh at your notions that somehow I don't know the Bible. Strike that; I point and laugh. In truth, you're not in my league. I expect that a discussion about lutherie or orthinology would yield the same silliness because you're not in my league there, either.

Originally posted by josephw
... I have never, nor will I ever, try to justify the Crusades or any other historical event that results in the unjustified death of anyone.

Try reading complete sentences this time. I did not say you justified the Crusades.

No wonder your Bible interpretation skills are so lacking; they follow your English skills.

Originally posted by Badwater
Try reading complete sentences this time. I did not say you justified the Crusades.

No wonder your Bible interpretation skills are so lacking; they follow your English skills.

"It's people like you that have justified evils such as the Crusades,"

Same thing.

Originally posted by Badwater
I would ask you to provide context to support your assertions, but you'd screw it up. I can read the Bible just fine, thank you; and furthermore, the context in which Jesus is foretelling his death is a means of preparing his disciples to carry on his teachings, not instructing them that from his death on they only need acknowledge his resurrection as their ...[text shortened]... orthinology would yield the same silliness because you're not in my league there, either.

I get a huge laugh at your notions that somehow I don't know the Bible. Strike that; I point and laugh. In truth, you're not in my league.

A demonstration of superior biblical knowledge would be more convincing than any empty claims of such superiority. If you are truly out of our league, perhaps you might deign to discuss the significance of this statement by Christ: "I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me" (John 14:6). What did Jesus mean by this?