Heaven and Hell

Heaven and Hell, good and evil are these real or just a means to control?
You have an opinion about these, is it simply based upon your own likes
and dislikes, and our stance on both, are they also just another matter of
control too? The reality of them really doesn't matter what we think since
our thoughts are only our opinions, and they live and die with us, they do
not create reality with respect to what is real or not.

Originally posted by KellyJay
Heaven and Hell, good and evil are these real or just a means to control?
You have an opinion about these, is it simply based upon your own likes
and dislikes, and our stance on both, are they also just another matter of
control too? The reality of them really doesn't matter what we think since
our thoughts are only our opinions, and they live and die with us, they do
not create reality with respect to what is real or not.

We all like a glass of wine on a Saturday night .. but best not to post afterwards.

Originally posted by wolfgang59
We all like a glass of wine on a Saturday night .. but best not to post afterwards.

Especially when it was Friday night 😛

Originally posted by divegeester
Especially when it was Friday night 😛

NZ time

I've been through obsessions before, which is from continually acceding to temptations. It is after the fact when this is realized, and we are left with those humiliating moments. I've never been possessed that I know.

Considering there is a difference between an evil and emptiness. An evil wants to exert control over its subjects and you can see the result, as in the latest shooting by a person who our secular culture describes as being 'disgruntled' to say the least. Continued emptiness leads to desperate situations. and in more dangerous fates ancient demons that led Islam astray and the like have come in to play. May be both literal and figurative...

Originally posted by Of Ants and Imps
and in more dangerous fates ancient demons that led Islam astray and the like have come in to play. May be both literal and figurative...

Well from the perspective of Muslims it was the Christian group that were "led astray" when their founders claimed mistakenly that a mortal prophet sent by the Abrahamic God was somehow God Himself.

Originally posted by FMF
Well from the perspective of Muslims it was the Christian group that were "led astray" when their founders claimed mistakenly that a mortal prophet sent by the Abrahamic God was somehow God Himself.

Well, I never recall seeing a Muslim post his perspective openly.

Originally posted by Of Ants and Imps
Well, I never recall seeing a Muslim post his perspective openly.

But you are surely aware of the place of Jesus in Islamic theology?

Ahh heaven and hell.
Hell being a purgatory to learn the lessons of attachment.

Heaven being a state of no time or space that envelops all of reality as we see it. 5th dimension.

What did you want to know about these realms?

Originally posted by Of Ants and Imps
I've been through obsessions before, which is from continually acceding to temptations. It is after the fact when this is realized, and we are left with those humiliating moments. I've never been possessed that I know.

Considering there is a difference between an evil and emptiness. An evil wants to exert control over its subjects and you can see ...[text shortened]... s that led Islam astray and the like have come in to play. May be both literal and figurative...

I do think evil has chains upon us, I think we are bound by our own sins. Even if you were
to look at man's life without the spiritual you'd see we are bound by habits. We do
somethings long enough, they become a part of our existence, even our thought patterns
can bind us. We can program ourselves to be negative always looking for something to
complain about, we can program ourselves to lust by always looking at some as objects
to be desired instead of people, we can always find fault. Our lives if we are not free will
mold us into what we are becoming, it isn't always drugs that bind people, it can be food,
hate, self importance, any thing that becomes a little god to us, so some sins are not as
easy to see as others, but they are all harmful to our souls. If we are not free and loving,
than what are we?

So even without demons, our lives can be bound, with them they could be worse. Neither
way matters however once Jesus enters the picture since as King of Kings He can set us
free of all that would bind us and harm us.

KJV Proverbs 5: 22 His own iniquities shall take the wicked himself, and he shall be holden with the cords of his sins.

Originally posted by KellyJay
I do think evil has chains upon us, I think we are bound by our own sins. Even if you were
to look at man's life without the spiritual you'd see we are bound by habits. We do
somethings long enough, they become a part of our existence, even our thought patterns
can bind us. We can program ourselves to be negative always looking for something to
complai ...[text shortened]... own iniquities shall take the wicked himself, and he shall be holden with the cords of his sins.

So most of humanity lives in a prison of their own design?

This makes complete sense on one level, but it also seems astoundingly simplistic on another. Many in the world do live in prisons of others' designs, through no fault of their own. I'm not disagreeing, mind you, I'm just trying to say that the problem has more than one dimension. Most Christians will tell you that not all of their problems suddenly disappear once they come to Christ.

It's popular to say that we create our own hell, but many have hell thrust upon them in life, regardless of the depth of their faith. We are told that we should 'endure to the end', and not expect that our problems will be overcome overnight.

Originally posted by KellyJay
I do think evil has chains upon us, I think we are bound by our own sins. Even if you were
to look at man's life without the spiritual you'd see we are bound by habits. We do
somethings long enough, they become a part of our existence, even our thought patterns
can bind us. We can program ourselves to be negative always looking for something to
complai ...[text shortened]... own iniquities shall take the wicked himself, and he shall be holden with the cords of his sins.

" it isn't always drugs that bind people .. "
lol.

Yeah , sometimes it's cults. Very hard to unbind yourself being in a cult 🙂

Seriously though, I find it important to distinguish between sins* that directly harm others and ones that only harm ourselves. Do you give more weight to some sins than others?

*I don't like this word because of the Christian overtones, however I can persist in using it for now

Originally posted by KellyJay
I do think evil has chains upon us, I think we are bound by our own sins. Even if you were
to look at man's life without the spiritual you'd see we are bound by habits. We do
somethings long enough, they become a part of our existence, even our thought patterns
can bind us. We can program ourselves to be negative always looking for something to
complai ...[text shortened]... own iniquities shall take the wicked himself, and he shall be holden with the cords of his sins.

You think saying things like "King of kings" makes Jesus any more appealing to modern progressive religious attitudes?

Originally posted by Suzianne
So most of humanity lives in a prison of their own design?

This makes complete sense on one level, but it also seems astoundingly simplistic on another. Many in the world do live in prisons of others' designs, through no fault of their own. I'm not disagreeing, mind you, I'm just trying to say that the problem has more than one dimension. Most Christi ...[text shortened]... that we should 'endure to the end', and not expect that our problems will be overcome overnight.

Who , in your opinion, DOESN'T live in a 'prison of their own design' ?

Originally posted by KellyJay

The reality of them really doesn't matter what we think since
our thoughts are only our opinions, and they live and die with us, they do
not create reality with respect to what is real or not.

I think they don't die with us. Our lives and opinions affect everyone around us, so there's that.

Plus I'm a great goddess fan. We rejoin. Our individuality is lost, but everything about us becomes part of all of it. I know I'm whack, but think about it. No reason for jealousy or pride. No reason to fear this great big afterlife problem. Attend to now, do your best, learn and love and teach.

I didn't do so good this time, but I progressed. I'll never be back, but I won't ever go away either.