Originally posted by cashthetrashThere are many former beliefs I discarded when learning they were false. I used to believe in Santa Claus. Now I don't. As my knowledge expands, my beliefs are altered accordingly. But christians are unable to do that. Despite finding out that their bible has a plethora of errors, contradictions, and heinous cruelties, they cannot update their beliefs to accomodate new knowledge, or they're unwilling to do so. They're locked into coming up with increasingly more outlandish apologetics to try to reconcile their bible with the way the world actually is.
In all honesty have you ever believed any falsehoods to be true at any point in your life? And latter reversed your thinking? If so then why should we have any trust in what you disbelieve as accurate? You seem to believe antichrist but reject pro-christ. I say by your own theory that everything you say should be rejected because you or someone you bel ...[text shortened]... scovered a mustard seed to small for you to know about at this time. Wouldn't you look foolish?
If the bible is admittedly written not by god, but by man, and it can be demonstrated to contain many errors, contradictions, and heinous cruelties, then why should anyone be expected to take any of it seriously?
Originally posted by cashthetrashHow do you know which parts accurately reflect god's supposed inspiration, and which parts have been adulterated by man's clumsiness? Do you just pick and choose as you like? If you do recognize that the bible contains a great many errors in it, then why can't the bible be updated and/or re-written? Why couldn't you re-write the mustard seed passage, for example, to bring it more in line with current scientific knowledge? Why do you doggedly cling to every demonstrable falsehood within the bible?
Well, I am not sure how it all works but if I were to literally believe everything in the bible were true, I would think the Arc Angel was more responsible for that. You know the serpent. Beelzebub or whatever name him and his followers go by. Now some of the authors were only human therefore mistake prone. Also those who have translated the Bible I am ...[text shortened]... d. I would interpret it, "the Bible" as God inspired but written by man. Many of them in fact.
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Originally posted by bearupyourcrossMark 4:31: 31 It is like a grain of mustard seed, which, when it is sown upon the earth, though it be less than all the seeds that are upon the earth,
Taken from http://home.teleport.com/~salad/4god/mustard.htm
Some people note that there are smaller seeds in existence,
and then claim that Jesus didn't know about those seeds.
Jesus NEVER said that.
The parable Jesus gave out has several conditions that are
specifically stated in the parable. To ignore all the other
statements Jesus ma ieve anything you say!
May I recommend a refresher course on simple logical thinking.
May I suggest a refresher course in the English language?
Originally posted by HalitoseGS= the believers, particularly evangelists,
[b]As an atheist, the god squad would say that I'm condemned to hell.
Who/what exactly is this "god squad"?
Also, how is disbelief in God's existence a sufficient cause for condemnation to hell?[/b]
Yes, I think you do go to hell for not believing, if you've had the opportunity.
Originally posted by cashthetrashWere they not inspired by god?
Well, I am not sure how it all works but if I were to literally believe everything in the bible were true, I would think the Arc Angel was more responsible for that. You know the serpent. Beelzebub or whatever name him and his followers go by. Now some of the authors were only human therefore mistake prone. Also those who have translated the Bible I am ...[text shortened]... d. I would interpret it, "the Bible" as God inspired but written by man. Many of them in fact.
It seems a bit lax to go through all of that and let men make mistakes in translating.
Originally posted by bearupyourcrossHave you considered taking one in brevity?
Taken from http://home.teleport.com/~salad/4god/mustard.htm
Some people note that there are smaller seeds in existence,
and then claim that Jesus didn't know about those seeds.
Jesus NEVER said that.
The parable Jesus gave out has several conditions that are
specifically stated in the parable. To ignore all the other
statements Jesus ma ...[text shortened]... ieve anything you say!
May I recommend a refresher course on simple logical thinking.
Originally posted by sugiezdYou said...
Huh?
Please elaborate.
"That's nice - do you see him in war, disease, famine?"
then I said "You know that"
Which means, I told you I see God in everything, and it means everything. Though it is very hard to see people suffer and it doesn't matter from what. I dont like it at all, it makes me scared.
Sometimes people bring these things like war and diseases unto themselves, and God is not to be blame for that. You cannot blame someone else for your own mistakes.
Originally posted by NickstenNo, you can't but, more often than not, disease attacks the innocent.
You said...
"That's nice - do you see him in war, disease, famine?"
then I said "You know that"
Which means, I told you I see God in everything, and it means everything. Though it is very hard to see people suffer and it doesn't matter from what. I dont like it at all, it makes me scared.
Sometimes people bring these things like war and diseases ...[text shortened]... and God is not to be blame for that. You cannot blame someone else for your own mistakes.
Care to justify god's position on that?
Originally posted by amannionthat trully is bizarre. do they beleive in heaven? i like the logic in "from dusk till dawn",
For many (probably most) of the Christians I know and work with, the idea of an actual real Devil is ridiculous.
"Well, I changed my lifetime tune about thirty minutes ago 'cause I know, without a doubt, what's out there trying to get in here is pure evil straight from hell. And if there is a hell, and those monsters are from it, there's got to be a heaven."
have your friends read the NT, where Jesus drives out demons? or the bit where jesus is tempted by the devil? or the bit where we are warned about temptation by the evil one, or, or, or..........
"how is disbelief in God's existence a sufficient cause for condemnation to hell?"
none of us deserve to go to heaven. we all deserve to go to hell. our lives are full of sin, and many of us are so blind to our sin we don't even realise it! that is, however, where Jesus comes in. Through Gods compassion he sent Jesus. "for god so loved the world that he gave his only son, that whoever beleive in him should not perish but have eternal life". Jesus died for our sin, so that we may live forever! basically...
"do you see him in war, disease, famine?"
as rwingett said, many believers find the OT embarassing. it's often as tought to deal with as the new testament! Obadiah talks about the punishment Edomite people shall receive for their sin. in the book of lamentations the author blames God for the starvation that is rife in Jerusalem. he does, however, say that it is a just punishment. theroughtout the so-called "minor prophets" we hear warnings about what shall happend if we do not listen to God and turn from our sins. in joel we have a plague of locus, whilst habakkuk predicts what lamentations later laments about.
Originally posted by rwingettSo the Bible is of no historical value? What about Biblical archeology? These are not evangelical zealots out to prove the Bible has historical relavence you know. It is, in fact, the only scientific discipline based upon a religious text. The Bible says it is there and they then start digging. Crazy huh?
No. None.
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Originally posted by HalitoseI think the Bible is clear in that God pursues men who place their faith in him. For example, it says that Abraham was justified by faith. Particular good and bad deeds are then not the issue. In the New covenant we are to place our faith in Christ and his sacrifice. Again we are justified by faith just as Abraham. The other end of the equation is blood sacrifice. In Abrahams day they sacrificed animals to atone for their sins. With the New Covenant Christ is our perpetual sacrifices to atone for our sins who place their faith in him. This is what we know about God and what he requires. On the one hand, he requires faith from us and, on the other hand, we require blood sacrifice to atone for our sins.
[b]As an atheist, the god squad would say that I'm condemned to hell.
Who/what exactly is this "god squad"?
Also, how is disbelief in God's existence a sufficient cause for condemnation to hell?[/b]
As far as who is "saved" and who is not there are plenty of "god squads" out there running around telling people they are going to hell, however, is this productive? The one making the decision is God himself. Therefore, if one is concerned about their eternal fate it would behoove one to seek him for the answer. If you asked me who is going to hell and who is not based upon the formula I provided above I would not answer. Who knows the heart of man other than God himself and how will God then respond? Granted, if one lives a life of unbelief as an atheist it does not appear to bode well for them come judgement day according to what God has already told us. Then again I guess that is why we have a judgement day.