Inclusive or Exclusive?

Originally posted by divegeester
Goodness me, we are in agreement again!

Now look what you started!😉

Originally posted by KellyJay
Well he has paid for them all, but I still agree with you that we need to
follow after and forsake our sins. Jesus pain the debt in full, but that just
opens the curtain for us to walk with God, rejecting Him after that leads
to other things.
Kelly

So what you are saying is that salvation is a gift with strings attached?
That's what it sounds like from you and Rajk999.

For God so loved the world that he gave...if?

Originally posted by checkbaiter
So what you are saying is that salvation is a gift with strings attached?
That's what it sounds like from you and Rajk999.

For God so loved the world that he gave...if?

Now you getting it :

John 8:31 Jesus said .. IF ye continue in my word, THEN are ye my disciples indeed;

Notice "IF" and "THEN"

Here is the devotional I received today...

HOW TO EXPERIENCE ETERNAL LIFE TODAY
John 17:3 "And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent."
JOHN 17:3
In order to fully understand what eternal life is, it is helpful to understand what it is not. Eternal life is not living forever. Everyone lives forever in either heaven or hell. Also, eternal life is not living forever in the blessings of heaven as opposed to being tormented in hell.
John 3:36 and 5:24 show that eternal life is a present tense possession of the believer.
Here, Jesus defines eternal life as knowing God the Father and Jesus Christ.
As we have already discussed, the word "know" is speaking of intimacy instead of mere intellectual knowledge. Therefore, eternal life is having an intimate, personal relationship with God the Father and Jesus the Son.
According to John 3:16, this intimacy with God is what salvation is all about. Forgiveness of our sins is not the point of salvation: intimacy with the Father is. Of course, Jesus did die to purchase forgiveness for our sins because unforgiven sins block us from intimacy with God. Sin was an obstacle that stood between us and God. It had to be dealt with and it was. Anyone who views salvation as only forgiveness of their sins and stops there, is missing out on eternal life.
Salvation is intended to be the way to come back into harmony with God.
Instead, it is often presented as the way to escape the problems of this life and the judgment of hell later.
Most non-believers are so occupied with their "hell on earth" that they don't really think or care about their eternal future. They are fed up with religion and are looking for something that will fill the emptiness inside.
Only intimate relationship (eternal life) with our Father can do that.
AWM Ministries

While I disagree with the first part about hell, I am posting this because I agree with the rest. Eternal life begins now.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
Here is the devotional I received today...

HOW TO EXPERIENCE ETERNAL LIFE TODAY
John 17:3 "And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent."
JOHN 17:3
In order to fully understand what eternal life is, it is helpful to understand what it is not. Eternal life is not living forever. Everyon ...[text shortened]... first part about hell, I am posting this because I agree with the rest. Eternal life begins now.

Can I ask you what this "AWM Ministries" is? Is it this? http://www.awmi.net/

Can I ask what denomination you claim?

Originally posted by Rajk999
Yes it does. All sin is of the devil. All righteousness is of God. But the important thing is to repent with a contrite heart and God forgives. If however I continue to sin there comes a point when God may not forgive. We have gone through those verses already.

The aim of the Christian is after accepting Christ is to follow in the footsteps of Jesus. Ther ...[text shortened]... hat you cannot lose your salvation and that Christ has paid for my sins past present and future.

You say "we've gone through verses already" as though you have somehow proved your point; you haven't by a long way. In fact your post only goes to show that even more! You admit you have sinned sinned and by your own definition are "of the devil" (your previous post to me). So when do you become "of god" again? If if god decides to "not forgive" as you put it here, at what point does that happen, and why did he forgive you when you sinned and became of the devil last time but decides not to forgive you next time, and is that position of his forever?

Originally posted by divegeester
Christ's spiritual death

What does this even mean?

Originally posted by checkbaiter
.. Eternal life begins now.

Eternal life begins now for all the Christians in the world today?
Or just for you?
Or for your congregation?
Who does your post apply to?

Personally my belief is similar to what Paul states here:

Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness; In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began; But hath in due times manifested his word through preaching, which is committed unto me according to the commandment of God our Saviour; (Titus 1:1-3 KJV)

I live in hope of eternal life one day.

Originally posted by divegeester
You say "we've gone through verses already" as though you have somehow proved your point; you haven't by a long way. In fact your post only goes to show that even more! You admit you have sinned sinned and by your own definition are "of the devil" (your previous post to me). So when do you become "of god" again? If if god decides to "not forgive" as you ...[text shortened]... e devil last time but decides not to forgive you next time, and is that position of his forever?

I deal only with what is written in the Bible. I dont not read the false interpretations of fallible men. My guide is the writings/teachings of Jesus Christ and the Apostles.

I cannot remember anywhere in the Bible which says people must know if/when they are forgiven. If you have references to support that please let me know.

Originally posted by Suzianne
Can I ask you what this "AWM Ministries" is? Is it this? http://www.awmi.net/

Can I ask what denomination you claim?

Yes, none

Originally posted by checkbaiter
So what you are saying is that salvation is a gift with strings attached?
That's what it sounds like from you and Rajk999.

For God so loved the world that he gave...if?

I am saying that simply believing in God is not enough, Satan believes it
does him no good. Jesus separates those that only mouth following him
and those that do, Paul warns over and over that we are not to get caught
up into sin and be over come by it. The end all be all is not so make a claim
that we now believe in Jesus, but once we do that we start to follow Him.

Look at Rev, look at 1st John, look at all the verses where we are told to
follow hard after Christ. Salvation is sure, we are forgiven when we come
to Christ, but that means we need to be COMING to Christ. That is not
living in sin, and mouthing a oh forgive me so I can go out and sin again,
because you've no intention on repenting.

The repentance will be a struggle, but anyone who is fighting the good
fight will be forgiven, those that want cover only to live a life of sin, will
find that their master sin will kill them. It is simply a matter of truth, when
we come to God we are forgiven, when we pretend, not so much.
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
I am saying that simply believing in God is not enough, Satan believes it
does him no good. Jesus separates those that only mouth following him
and those that do, Paul warns over and over that we are not to get caught
up into sin and be over come by it. The end all be all is not so make a claim
that we now believe in Jesus, but once we do that we start ...[text shortened]... ly a matter of truth, when
we come to God we are forgiven, when we pretend, not so much.
Kelly

I guess I am not getting my point across...I am going to provide a link to a free audio teaching to listen to at your leisure, if you choose to listen at all.

He deals with both extremes wrapped up in one teaching. He will point out the popular verses covered here on both sides.

1. Once saved always saved
2. Conditional salvation.

http://downloads.awmi.net/teaching/awm_k16_security.mp3