Mark of the beast

Originally posted by galveston75
I agree. I would never take my spiritual food and directions from any man made organization. But I would from one that is backed by God and directed by his son....

That group would be?



Manny

It can be understood as the beast being a being of some sort or argued that way anyway. If a group or government was slain and then brought back to life it loses its meaning a bit ------But if a person or being were slain then suddenly brought back to life people would be amazed and if any inanimate object suddenly was brought to life now that seems to make more sense. Context is everything G-Man but I bet the elders or brothers don't teach you that.

Manny

Originally posted by menace71
It can be understood as the beast being a being of some sort or argued that way anyway. If a group or government was slain and then brought back to life it loses its meaning a bit ------But if a person or being were slain then suddenly brought back to life people would be amazed and if any inanimate object suddenly was brought to life now that seems to make ...[text shortened]... . Context is everything G-Man but I bet the elders or brothers don't teach you that.

Manny

In the book of Daniel, it is the horns on the beast that are identified as Kings and thus could be thought of as individual human rulers of the beast Empire. In the case of the first beast that came out of the sea in Revelation 13, it was one of its seven heads that appeared as if it had been slain and his fatal wound was healed. So it just appeared that way, and regardless of what that means, the other six heads did not appear that way. So are we to assume that the entire beast was slain just because one of its seven heads appeared healed from a deadly wound? Well, you could get that impression from what is said when the second beast appears out of the earth. However, I am not sure that would be what John meant.

The second beast that came out of the earth in Revelation 13 is said to have only two horns and not ten horns as was the case of the first beast. It mentions nothing about heads or diadems for the second beast. So this second beast spoke like a dragon, but had lamb-like human rulers. These two human leaders could be the AntiChrist and the false prophet. However, Revelation never mentions the Antichrist with the false prophet, but instead it says the beast and the false prophet.

So it appears that the true political, economic, and government ruler of the second beast is the Antichrist horn and the other horn is the religious leader and is called the false prophet. So if this is the correct interpretation, we would be saying the second beast is synonymous with the Antichrist, because the Antichrist is the true ruler of this beast empire or kingdom. So in that sense, Susianne is right in saying the beast is a man, since the reason his kingdom is seen as a beast is because of how the Antichrist rules over it.

The Instructor

Originally posted by menace71
It can be understood as the beast being a being of some sort or argued that way anyway. If a group or government was slain and then brought back to life it loses its meaning a bit ------But if a person or being were slain then suddenly brought back to life people would be amazed and if any inanimate object suddenly was brought to life now that seems to make ...[text shortened]... . Context is everything G-Man but I bet the elders or brothers don't teach you that.

Manny

Context of the whole bible is everything Manny. We do not pick and choose as many here do. ( Example: A couple scriptures have been tweeked in some Bibles that confusingly say Jesus is God himself. But the vast majority says he is not. So instead of looking at the entire Bible, some only see those couple tweeked scriptures as being fact and ignor the rest.)
Until you ever get over this mindset that you and Ron are so consumed with, you might actually listen and reason on things being discussed a little better.
But then I don't expect that to really happen, right?

Originally posted by Suzianne
Can you read, Gman?

"Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number [is] Six hundred threescore [and] six." -- Rev. 13:18, KJV

"count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man"

A man. The number of the beast is the number of a man. A man.

How is that not ...[text shortened]... rstand your Bible uses the word 'it' but that is because you must honor your doctrine.)

Can you read??????????? It says it is the number of a man, not that it is a man itself. If it were a man then why the need for the number to be on it? We would already know it was a man. Don't add what is not there.
And you seem to miss that fact that all the other beast in these context are all referring to govenrments or entities that are against God and that will be destroyed in the lake of fire.
Not once does the Bible ever says these are a single individual, ever.

People, is this argument really benefiting anybody except those sitting on the sidelines eating their popcorn and watching the entertainment? See my point...

http://www.amazon.com/Gorbachev-Has-Real-Antichrist-Come/dp/0932081193

If we are busy looking for the man of sin, we will miss the King.

Originally posted by kd2acz
People, is this argument really benefiting anybody except those sitting on the sidelines eating their popcorn and watching the entertainment? See my point...

http://www.amazon.com/Gorbachev-Has-Real-Antichrist-Come/dp/0932081193

If we are busy looking for the man of sin, we will miss the King.

Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

2 Thessalonians 2:1-12 NKJV)

HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord! Glory be to God! Holy! Holy! Holy!

The Instructor

I have been thinking about the seven heads of the first beast empire mentioned in Revelation 13 and especially about the head that appeared to have been slain and the fatal wound healed. So afer reading the following link, I begain to wonder if this head could be referring to Iraq, which appeared to have been slain during the Gulf War by the United States and its coalition of the willing nations.

http://www.alphanewsdaily.com/Nations%20Iraq.html

Any opinions?

The Instructor

Let's take another look at the following verses again:

Then I stood on the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast rising up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and on his horns ten crowns, and on his heads a blasphemous name. Now the beast which I saw was like a leopard, his feet were like the feet of a bear, and his mouth like the mouth of a lion. The dragon gave him his power, his throne, and great authority. And I saw one of his heads as if it had been mortally wounded, and his deadly wound was healed. And all the world marveled and followed the beast. So they worshiped the dragon who gave authority to the beast; and they worshiped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast? Who is able to make war with him?”

And he was given a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies, and he was given authority to continue for forty-two months. Then he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme His name, His tabernacle, and those who dwell in heaven. It was granted to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them. And authority was given him over every tribe, tongue, and nation. All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

(Revelation 13:1-8 NKJV)

I was looking at many translations of these verses and found that most translations used the words "worship and worshiped" to translate the Greek, but one translation had "bow low and bowed to the ground" instead. It was that one translation that got me curious enough to check out my copy of Strong's Concordance and Thayer's Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament.

The strong's number is 4352: The main lexicon meaning is to prostrate one's self; hence among the Orientals,esp. the Persians, to fall upon the knees and touch the ground with the forehead as an expression of profound reverence, (to make a 'salam'😉; hence in the N.T. by kneeling or prostration to do homage (to one) or make obeisance, whether in order to express respect or to make supplication. it is used of homage shown to men of superior rank; of homage rendered to God and the ascended Christ, to heavenly beings, and demons: (our to worship).

Reminds me more and more of the Muslims for some reason. How about you?

The Instructor

Originally posted by RJHinds
I have been thinking about the seven heads of the first beast empire mentioned in Revelation 13 and especially about the head that appeared to have been slain and the fatal wound healed. So afer reading the following link, I begain to wonder if this head could be referring to Iraq, which appeared to have been slain during the Gulf War by the United States a ...[text shortened]... ations.

http://www.alphanewsdaily.com/Nations%20Iraq.html

Any opinions?

The Instructor

So you conveniently forget about countries like North Korea and Iran? You think that pathetic country of Iraq would reach that kind of status? Again, your show of ignorance is unbounded.

Originally posted by sonhouse
So you conveniently forget about countries like North Korea and Iran? You think that pathetic country of Iraq would reach that kind of status? Again, your show of ignorance is unbounded.

Oh, Iran is in there all righty. it is surely one of the heads of the beast.

The Instructor

Originally posted by RJHinds
Oh, Iran is in there all righty. it is surely one of the heads of the beast.

The Instructor

The other head of the beast could just as well be the United States.

Originally posted by sonhouse
The other head of the beast could just as well be the United States.

No the United states is not there. These heads are all kings/kingdoms.

The Instructor

Originally posted by RJHinds
No the United states is not there. These heads are all kings/kingdoms.

The Instructor

You perhaps forget the United States is the one, the ONLY one to ever use atomic weapons on civilians?

Originally posted by sonhouse
You perhaps forget the United States is the one, the ONLY one to ever use atomic weapons on civilians?

You forget that Pakistan is an islamic nation that already has nuclear weapons and iran is working on that ability and Iran's leaders has threatened to wipe israel off the map. Israel is believed to have nuclear weapons also.

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/international/countriesandterritories/iran/nuclear_program/index.html

Pakistan and weapons of mass destruction

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan_and_weapons_of_mass_destruction

The instructor