Melchizedec

I am sorry that this thread created another cat-fight. I am still hoping to have some others wade in on this theory. Jaywill? I trust your interpretations. Dystoniac? Epi? Josephw? I have wondered about Melchizedec for so many years. Pastors have tried to touch on possible answers, but he still is a mystery. Maybe you are all in the same boat as I.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
No, one must be careful of those who cannot even substantiate their own claims and cannot even tell the difference between Christ and Almighty God, the meaning of even basic bible words such as soul and whether it is mortal or immortal!

as yet you have failed to answer or substantiate any one of these claims and yet you have the audacity to call into question the teachings of others because they can, that my friend is hypocrisy!

You do not know your Bible, boy. You need to go to Sunday school and start over with the pre-elementary school kids. Stop giving ill-advised lessons on scripture!

http://www.everystudent.com/wires/whodoyousay.html

Is Jesus God? How he implied he was God:

The Jews therefore said to Him, "You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?" Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am." Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself, and went out of the temple. (John 8:57-59)

"I and the Father are one." The Jews took up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, "I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?" The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God." (John 10:30-33)

And Jesus cried out and said, "He who believes in Me does not believe in Me, but in Him who sent Me. And he who beholds Me beholds the One who sent Me. I have come as light into the world, that everyone who believes in Me may not remain in darkness." (John 12:44-46)

And so when He had washed their feet, and taken His garments, and reclined at the table again, He said to them, "Do you know what I have done to you? You call Me Teacher and Lord; and you are right, for I am. If I then, the Lord and the Teacher, washed your feet, you also ought to wash one another's feet." (John 13:12-14)

Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me. If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; from now on you know Him, and have seen Him." Philip said to Him, "Lord, show us the Father, and it is enough for us." Jesus said to him, "Have I been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how do you say, 'Show us the Father'?" (John 14:6-9)

Originally posted by dystoniac
You do not know your Bible, boy. You need to go to Sunday school and start over with the pre-elementary school kids. Stop giving ill-advised lessons on scripture!

http://www.everystudent.com/wires/whodoyousay.html

Is Jesus God? How he implied he was God:

The Jews therefore said to Him, "You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham? ...[text shortened]... has seen the Father; how do you say, 'Show us the Father'?" (John 14:6-9)

Going to Sunday school is the lasts thing an individual should do if he wants to seek a grain of Biblical truth, for it is nothing but the blind leading the blind, as is clearly evident from your lack of understanding concerning any one of the scripture that you quote

For example that Christ had a pre human existence, is clearly evident, but this does not make him Almighty God, for the scriptures state regarding his pre human existence that he was a created being, or have you never read Colossians chapter 1 verse 15

He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation - Col 1:15, clearly Christ has not always existed, but had a pre human existence and was created by God -

the second reference also betrays a real lack of anything remotely resembling understanding, for Christ also said of the disciples that they were also to be one, following you 'logic', and in your case i use the word tentatively, that would mean that the disciples were also God, or have you never read

“I make request, not concerning these only, but also concerning those putting faith in me through their word; in order that they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in union with me and I am in union with you, that they also may be in union with us, in order that the world may believe that you sent me forth.

How the Christ being one with the father and the disciples translates into him being God, i will never know.

these other references don't even wash and are not worthy of commenting upon, for the scripture at Colossians clearly indicates that Christ was the image, or the perfect reflection of his father, not actually almighty God as you have erroneously asserted. No one has seen God, have they, yet many people saw Christ, God cannot die, can he, yet Christ died, didn't he, God has always existed, yet Christ was a created being, so one again you are talking nonsense and if i didn't feel some compassion for you, which i do, i would toast these other arguments as well!

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Going to Sunday school is the lasts thing an individual should do if he wants to seek a grain of Biblical truth, for it is nothing but the blind leading the blind, as is clearly evident from your lack of understanding concerning any one of the scripture that you quote

For example that Christ had a pre human existence, is clearly evident, but this ...[text shortened]... dn't feel some compassion for you, which i do, i would toast these other arguments as well!

What sect do you belong to...the Unitarian Universalist Unorthodox Utilitarian Utopians? The UUUUU? You blokes need to quit trying to catch the Hale Bop Comet.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
the difference being i can substantiate my beliefs, for there is no credable biblical evidence or otherwise to suggest that Christ was Almighty God, in the spirit or the flesh. For he was a created being or have you never read Colossians chapter 1 verse 15.

He is the image of the invisible God, [b]the firstborn of all creation

thus Christ ...[text shortened]... ad a beginning, he has not always existed as has Almighty God, who has no beginning nor any end.[/b]

As we veer off topic again at warp speed, Jesus said "If you have seen Me, you have seen the Father. I and the Father are One." That's about as clear as it gets for me, but I know--there are Trinitarians and there are....well, other-arians, and we just need to agree to disagree.

As for the priest Melchizedek, he is a mystery. I rank him up there with Enoch, Aachen, Onan, the dead guy who was tossed into the hole where Elisha's bones lay and immediately sprang to life, Barrabus, the Witch of Endor, and Hosea as my list of Bible personalities I'd like to know more about.

Originally posted by divegeester
That probably rules out at least 90% of us 🙂

Only 90%? So there are 600,000,000 bible scholars around, never knew that🙂

Originally posted by dystoniac
What sect do you belong to...the Unitarian Universalist Unorthodox Utilitarian Utopians? The UUUUU? You blokes need to quit trying to catch the Hale Bop Comet.

oh my friend it is a typical comment, you have no logical nor reasonable answer and you descend into fantasy, i will let you alone this time for i have a great sympathy and compassion for someone who is facing your kind of problems, i say this in sincerity, when my wife was in hospital there was a lady beside her who because of some aberration of the mind she could not always control her muscular movements, thus she found it extremely difficult to sleep, my heart really went out to her, as it does to you, but next time, make sure you have the readies to back up your statements, otherwise your toast!😛

singing out - robbie carrobie minister of the newly formed Electric church of the latter day Hendrix fans!

Originally posted by PinkFloyd
As we veer off topic again at warp speed, Jesus said "If you have seen Me, you have seen the Father. I and the Father are One." That's about as clear as it gets for me, but I know--there are Trinitarians and there are....well, other-arians, and we just need to agree to disagree.

As for the priest Melchizedek, he is a mystery. I rank him up there with ...[text shortened]... he Witch of Endor, and Hosea as my list of Bible personalities I'd like to know more about.

John 1 :18 also says that no one has seen the father and john 17 also states that the disciples and Christ were to be one, therefore what have you to say for yourself now!

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
oh my friend it is a typical comment, you have no logical nor reasonable answer and you descend into fantasy, i will let you alone this time for i have a great sympathy and compassion for someone who is facing your kind of problems, i say this in sincerity, when my wife was in hospital there was a lady beside her who because of some aberration of th ...[text shortened]... t - robbie carrobie minister of the newly formed Electric church of the latter day Hendrix fans!

I had back-up that 'backed-up my statement. Did you not go to the website? My logis was Biblical. Ok, I know that I cannot convince you to see my point of view, and vice versa, so let's let it be. I appreciate your concern for my medical condition, but rest assured I am not disabled in the least bit. Peace-out....and "Purple Haze".

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
John 1 :18 also says that no one has seen the father and john 17 also states that the disciples and Christ were to be one, therefore what have you to say for yourself now!

I say you gots yore verses and I gots my verses, and since perfect doctrine is not a requirement for salvation, we'll both have forgotten this conversation as we sit together one day at the Heavenly gates.

Originally posted by dystoniac
I had back-up that 'backed-up my statement. Did you not go to the website? My logis was Biblical. Ok, I know that I cannot convince you to see my point of view, and vice versa, so let's let it be. I appreciate your concern for my medical condition, but rest assured I am not disabled in the least bit. Peace-out....and "Purple Haze".

no i in no way was suggestive that you are disabled my friend, lets just say i have a certain sympathy for those who suffer, as we all do no doubt, and i think its time the forum could do with spreading a little compassion. why should i go to a website when all the scriptures one could hope to possibly need are in the Bible? also it is not a case of convincing me, who am I after all, but its a case of what is true, for we are Christians and truth is paramount, or should be.

Originally posted by PinkFloyd
I say you gots yore verses and I gots my verses, and since perfect doctrine is not a requirement for salvation, we'll both have forgotten this conversation as we sit together one day at the Heavenly gates.

Actually my friend i am not planning on going to heaven, never have been. Now in sincerity i ask you to consider this, why is it, if we are supposed to believe in the immortality of the human 'soul', is it that we are devastated when someone dies? Nothing can prepare us for this eventuality, we are completely floored by it! If we truly thought that our loved one was going to a better place we would be happy, but it is not the case, atheist, theist, one and all are floored! Now you may say that this is a natural reaction, but i take it as indicative that we do not really believe in our hearts that our loved ones have gone to a better place, for the soul is not immortal and nothing transcends death! But also if something survives death, why are we as Christians awaiting the resurrection? for if something survives death, there would be no need of a resurrection, for we have not died but transcended death, however, quite clearly the scriptures indicate that this is not the case! And my dear sir, it is not enough to claim i have my faith and you have yours, for we as Christians are under duress to establish was is true! But that aside, i also have loved Pink Floyd from my youth, my favorite song is a song from The final cut, the gunners dream -

The Gunner's Dream (Waters)

Floating down through the clouds
Memories come rushing up to meet me now.
In the space between the heavens
and in the corner of some foreign field
I had a dream.
I had a dream.
Good-bye Max.
Good-bye Ma.
After the service when you're walking slowly to the car
And the silver in her hair shines in the cold November air
You hear the tolling bell
And touch the silk in your lapel
And as the tear drops rise to meet the comfort of the band
You take her frail hand
And hold on to the dream.
A place to stay
"Oi! A real one ..."
Enough to eat
Somewhere old heroes shuffle safely down the street
Where you can speak out loud
About your doubts and fears
And what's more no-one ever disappears
You never hear their standard issue kicking in your door.
You can relax on both sides of the tracks
And maniacs don't blow holes in bandsmen by remote control
And everyone has recourse to the law
And no-one kills the children anymore.
And no one kills the children anymore.

Night after night
Going round and round my brain
His dream is driving me insane.
In the corner of some foreign field
The gunner sleeps tonight.
What's done is done.
We cannot just write off his final scene.
Take heed of his dream.
Take heed.

I have always felt that this reference to 'maniacs don't blow holes in bandsmen by remote control', was a reference to the CIA instigated killing of Lennon, what say you?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Actually my friend i am not planning on going to heaven, never have been. Now in sincerity i ask you to consider this, why is it, if we are supposed to believe in the immortality of the human 'soul', is it that we are devastated when someone dies? Nothing can prepare us for this eventuality, we are completely floored by it! If we truly thought tha ote control', was a reference to the CIA instigated killing of Lennon, what say you?

I think your CIA theory is sound, and that you have excellent musical taste
As for the death argument, you start from the false premise that "we are devastated when someone dies?" My church rejoices when someone reached the afterlife and escapes "the surly bonds of earth."😀

Originally posted by PinkFloyd
I think your CIA theory is sound, and that you have excellent musical taste
As for the death argument, you start from the false premise that "we are devastated when someone dies?" My church rejoices when someone reached the afterlife and escapes "the surly bonds of earth."😀

really, your church rejoices, is this thing common in churches or just your own? when i die I want a New Orleans style Jazz band playin al the way down to the beach where i will be put in a Viking long boat, set alight in a funeral pyre and drifted out to sea, in true Viking style.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
really, your church rejoices, is this thing common in churches or just your own? when i die I want a New Orleans style Jazz band playin al the way down to the beach where i will be put in a Viking long boat, set alight in a funeral pyre and drifted out to sea, in true Viking style.

As I only belong to one church, I can't say if we have a common practice or not; I have no frame of reference. As for the New Orleans funeral, The Big Easy is a place I hope never to sea, in life or death, but to each his own; I hope you make it safely to Ragnarok. Or is it Valhalla? 🙂