13 Jun '07 21:57>
I don’t know that I’ve never been guilty of this in the heat of debate (I have been guilty of some bad behavior); I hope not, but—
Over the past few years, I’ve seen an awful lot of putative mind-readers practice their wares on here in derogation of their opponents. I don’t just mean misunderstanding, or the perennial “so what you’re really saying is _________?”. Nor do I mean simple recognition of sarcasm. Nor do I mean pointing out, even sharply, contradictions that someone has committed. Nor do I even mean questioning one’s opponent’s motivations.
I mean actually telling someone in serious debate that they do not really think what they are saying, that they have hidden agendas or ulterior motives. I mean actual accusations of deceit, that could only themselves be honestly stated if the accuser actually knows what is going on the mind of the accused.
I have had it happen to me (though not recently). I have actually had it happen as the result of my raising questions for discussion/debate, before the debate even started. Now, I have actually taken positions solely for the purpose of debating a given issue—but I usually try to take care to state that at the outset. I have altered my views on issues, and consistency (foolish or not) has perhaps never been my particular “hobgoblin.” But, again—
There is nothing more aggravating than to have someone slap you in the face with “what you really mean” (sometimes accompanied by further insulting remarks) when you are honestly trying to express what you think. There is no argument that can be made in response. One can protest; one can simply tell the putative mind-reader that what they just said is a lie. But any meaningful argument is done.
It is especially aggravating to one who tries, as best they can, to continually examine their own mind to root out self-deceit and repressed motivations and the like—out of a concern for self-integrity. I’d like to be able to shrug it off with some serenity, but I have not reached that stage, and sometimes it gives me a sick feeling in the gut. Even if I am not the target. (That sensitivity has sometimes led me to lash out unfairly at persons that I thought were accusing me of deceit, when they were in fact doing no such thing.)
I don’t mind having my motivations honestly questioned—as in asking me the question, without presumption.
I know there are people on here who dislike each other (or at least their personae on here); there are some that I dislike, and that doubtless dislike me. There are some people with whom I disagree almost all the time, and to whom I have sometimes said things that I later regret, that I actually like quite a bit. I trust you know who you are. There are those who are personally, morally offended by the positions that some others hold, and who express that offense passionately. Fine.
But I don’t believe there are any real mind-readers on here (under whatever mantle such mind-reading is claimed). And I really wish those who succumb to the pretense would try to refrain.
Over the past few years, I’ve seen an awful lot of putative mind-readers practice their wares on here in derogation of their opponents. I don’t just mean misunderstanding, or the perennial “so what you’re really saying is _________?”. Nor do I mean simple recognition of sarcasm. Nor do I mean pointing out, even sharply, contradictions that someone has committed. Nor do I even mean questioning one’s opponent’s motivations.
I mean actually telling someone in serious debate that they do not really think what they are saying, that they have hidden agendas or ulterior motives. I mean actual accusations of deceit, that could only themselves be honestly stated if the accuser actually knows what is going on the mind of the accused.
I have had it happen to me (though not recently). I have actually had it happen as the result of my raising questions for discussion/debate, before the debate even started. Now, I have actually taken positions solely for the purpose of debating a given issue—but I usually try to take care to state that at the outset. I have altered my views on issues, and consistency (foolish or not) has perhaps never been my particular “hobgoblin.” But, again—
There is nothing more aggravating than to have someone slap you in the face with “what you really mean” (sometimes accompanied by further insulting remarks) when you are honestly trying to express what you think. There is no argument that can be made in response. One can protest; one can simply tell the putative mind-reader that what they just said is a lie. But any meaningful argument is done.
It is especially aggravating to one who tries, as best they can, to continually examine their own mind to root out self-deceit and repressed motivations and the like—out of a concern for self-integrity. I’d like to be able to shrug it off with some serenity, but I have not reached that stage, and sometimes it gives me a sick feeling in the gut. Even if I am not the target. (That sensitivity has sometimes led me to lash out unfairly at persons that I thought were accusing me of deceit, when they were in fact doing no such thing.)
I don’t mind having my motivations honestly questioned—as in asking me the question, without presumption.
I know there are people on here who dislike each other (or at least their personae on here); there are some that I dislike, and that doubtless dislike me. There are some people with whom I disagree almost all the time, and to whom I have sometimes said things that I later regret, that I actually like quite a bit. I trust you know who you are. There are those who are personally, morally offended by the positions that some others hold, and who express that offense passionately. Fine.
But I don’t believe there are any real mind-readers on here (under whatever mantle such mind-reading is claimed). And I really wish those who succumb to the pretense would try to refrain.