22 Feb 07
Miss Communication: “God is all-loving.”
Christian: “No, He’s not.”
Miss Communication: “Yes, He is. The Bible says so.”
Christian: “No, it doesn’t. It says that God is love.”
Miss Communication: “See.”
Christian: “But that doesn’t say He’s all-loving. He’s not a slave to love. The Bible reveals that He’s also just, holy, and righteous.”
Miss Communication: “So. . . what does that mean?”
Christian: “When people say God is all-loving, they are implying God is
so loving that He wouldn’t send people to hell.”
Miss Communication: “Well, if He was loving, He wouldn’t send anyone
to hell.”
Christian: “I have a question for you. If a man sexually abused children, tortured them, cut their throats, and said he would do it again if he had half a chance, should a judge punish him?”
Miss Communication: “Of course.”
Christian: “What if the judge is a loving man?”
Miss Communication: “He should still punish that wicked person.”
Christian: “Right . . . and God will punish all wicked men, even though
He is ‘love.’ Does that make sense?”
Miss Communication: “Now it does.”
22 Feb 07
Originally posted by RBHILLHe may or may not be love, but he sure is dull!
Miss Communication: “God is all-loving.”
Christian: “No, He’s not.”
Miss Communication: “Yes, He is. The Bible says so.”
Christian: “No, it doesn’t. It says that God is love.”
Miss Communication: “See.”
Christian: “But that doesn’t say He’s all-loving. He’s not a slave to love. The Bible reveals that He’s also just, holy, and righteous.”
Miss ...[text shortened]... ked men, even though
He is ‘love.’ Does that make sense?”
Miss Communication: “Now it does.”
22 Feb 07
Originally posted by RBHILLI have asked this over and over again and nobody has even attempted an answer: Why does God punish? We know why a judge punishes, but none of those reasons apply to God.
Christian: “I have a question for you. If a man sexually abused children, tortured them, cut their throats, and said he would do it again if he had half a chance, should a judge punish him?”
22 Feb 07
Originally posted by twhiteheadBeacuse without punishment, there is no adequate balance between success in following god and failure for not following him. Thus, in a world where apathy yields no consequence, people just wouldn't bother. They need the threat of punishment to balance the concept of reward.
I have asked this over and over again and nobody has even attempted an answer: Why does God punish? We know why a judge punishes, but none of those reasons apply to God.
22 Feb 07
Originally posted by StarrmanSo if God is truly good he may actually not punish in the end as it is the threat that is required not the actual punishment?
Beacuse without punishment, there is no adequate balance between success in following god and failure for not following him. Thus, in a world where apathy yields no consequence, people just wouldn't bother. They need the threat of punishment to balance the concept of reward.
Doesn't your concept render the whole concept of forgiveness (being preached by Christians) faulty as it takes away the threat of punishment that is so essential?
22 Feb 07
Originally posted by twhiteheadI'd say it is because God has given us a will of our own, and holds us accountable for it.
I have asked this over and over again and nobody has even attempted an answer: Why does God punish? We know why a judge punishes, but none of those reasons apply to God.
Kelly
22 Feb 07
Originally posted by twhiteheadYes.
So if God is truly good he may actually not punish in the end as it is the threat that is required not the actual punishment?
Doesn't your concept render the whole concept of forgiveness (being preached by Christians) faulty as it takes away the threat of punishment that is so essential?
22 Feb 07
Originally posted by KellyJayThat doesn't yet answer the question. Why does he 'hold us accountable for it' and what do you mean by 'hold us accountable' and what purpose does the punishment serve?
I'd say it is because God has given us a will of our own, and holds us accountable for it.
Kelly
22 Feb 07
1 edit
Originally posted by RBHILLMiss Communication: "Who qualifies as a wicked man?"
Miss Communication: “God is all-loving.”
Christian: “No, He’s not.”
Miss Communication: “Yes, He is. The Bible says so.”
Christian: “No, it doesn’t. It says that God is love.”
Miss Communication: “See.”
Christian: “But that doesn’t say He’s all-loving. He’s not a slave to love. The Bible reveals that He’s also just, holy, and righteous.”
Miss ...[text shortened]... ked men, even though
He is ‘love.’ Does that make sense?”
Miss Communication: “Now it does.”
Christian: "Everybody, from a candy bar thief to a mass-murderer."
MC: "That candy bar thief doesn't sound nearly as evil as the torturing, throat-cutting thug you described earlier."
C: "God says that he is."
MC: "That doesn't seem like a fair justice system."
C: "Well, God works in mysterious ways. Unbelievers like you lack the spiritual discernment to truly understand."
MC: "If we are all evil, how do we get out of punishment?"
C: "Well, God ordered a hit on his own son. Ask his son to put in a good word for you upstairs, and you can escape punishment."
MC: "So the candy bar thief who does not talk to the son gets punished, and the mass murderer who does talk to the son gets off scot-free?!"
C: "Correct."
MC: "That seems grossly unjust. And it smacks of favoritism."
C: "Hey, they had their chance to work the system."
MC: "It sounds like a bad mafia movie. Those who become 'friends of the family' get protected; those outside the family get 'offed'."
C: 😕
23 Feb 07
1 edit
Originally posted by twhiteheadI would say because God is Holy and doesn't like sin in His presence.( And not meaning gifts)
I have asked this over and over again and nobody has even attempted an answer: Why does God punish? We know why a judge punishes, but none of those reasons apply to God.
23 Feb 07
Originally posted by RBHILLIt would be so nice if the real world could be judged in such a simplistic way. . .
Miss Communication: “God is all-loving.”
Christian: “No, He’s not.”
Miss Communication: “Yes, He is. The Bible says so.”
Christian: “No, it doesn’t. It says that God is love.”
Miss Communication: “See.”
Christian: “But that doesn’t say He’s all-loving. He’s not a slave to love. The Bible reveals that He’s also just, holy, and righteous.”
Miss ...[text shortened]... ked men, even though
He is ‘love.’ Does that make sense?”
Miss Communication: “Now it does.”
23 Feb 07
1 edit
Originally posted by RBHILLLOL! You really crack me up, RB!
I would say because God is Holy and doesn't like sin in His presence.( And not meaning gifts)
Thanks for that penetrating clarification at the end. Because, you know, by "God...doesn't like sin in His presence" I really thought you meant that God doesn't enjoy opening up His presents only to find sin hunkering around in there.
I almost enjoy that as much as the whole 'faith whale' thing.
23 Feb 07
Originally posted by twhiteheadYou have the ability to do what you will, you do what you will and you will give an account for your choices. Simple enough, I don't see how that doesn't answer the question, the question I was answering was,
That doesn't yet answer the question. Why does he 'hold us accountable for it' and what do you mean by 'hold us accountable' and what purpose does the punishment serve?
"Why does God punish?"
You do good, good things happen, you do bad, bad things do.
Kelly