24 Jan 14
Do Christians agree with this statement from 1 Corinthians 14:34-35 (NIV)?
Women should remain silent in the churches. They are not
allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the law says.
If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their
own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to
speak in the church.
If Christians do not agree with it, how are they able to decide
on which passages of the NT to follow and which are rubbish?
24 Jan 14
Originally posted by wolfgang59
Do Christians agree with this statement from 1 Corinthians 14:34-35 (NIV)?
Women should remain silent in the churches. They are not
allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the law says.
If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their
own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to
speak in the church. ...[text shortened]... h it, how are they able to decide
on which passages of the NT to follow and which are rubbish?
“These things I have spoken to you, that you should not be made to stumble. They will put you out of the synagogues; yes, the time is coming that whoever kills you will think that he offers God service. And these things they will do to you because they have not known the Father nor Me. But these things I have told you, that when the time comes, you may remember that I told you of them.
And these things I did not say to you at the beginning, because I was with you.
“But now I go away to Him who sent Me, and none of you asks Me, ‘Where are You going?’ But because I have said these things to you, sorrow has filled your heart. Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: of sin, because they do not believe in Me; of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.
“I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you. All things that the Father has are Mine. Therefore I said that He will take of Mine and declare it to you.
(John 16:1-15 NKJV)
24 Jan 14
Originally posted by wolfgang59yes I agree with it. In order to understand the passage you must look at the context in which it was given.
Do Christians agree with this statement from 1 Corinthians 14:34-35 (NIV)?
Women should remain silent in the churches. They are not
allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the law says.
If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their
own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to
speak in the church. ...[text shortened]... h it, how are they able to decide
on which passages of the NT to follow and which are rubbish?
24 Jan 14
Originally posted by robbie carrobiebe clearer. understanding why this suggestion was given is not the same thing as agreeing with it.
yes I agree with it. In order to understand the passage you must look at the context in which it was given.
for example, i understand the context in which slavery was invented, yet i don't agree with it.
so again, do you agree with the statement that women shouldn't offer knowledge to someone else?
24 Jan 14
Originally posted by Zahlanzino because that is not what the passage is saying, indeed you will now say how its possible for a Christian sister to have a public ministry teaching and preaching the goodnews of Gods Kingdom if she cannot impart knowledge to others, such a view finds no support in the scriptures. Indeed,
be clearer. understanding why this suggestion was given is not the same thing as agreeing with it.
for example, i understand the context in which slavery was invented, yet i don't agree with it.
so again, do you agree with the statement that women shouldn't offer knowledge to someone else?
Jehovah gives the command;
The women proclaiming the good news are a large army
Psalm 68:11
24 Jan 14
Originally posted by robbie carrobiethe bible is clear. a woman must be silent in church and not presume to teach others.
no because that is not what the passage is saying, indeed you will now say how its possible for a Christian sister to have a public ministry teaching and preaching the goodnews of Gods Kingdom if she cannot impart knowledge to others, such a view finds no support in the scriptures. Indeed,
Jehovah gives the command;
The women proclaiming the good news are a large army
Psalm 68:11
now i ask again. do you agree with this assessment or not? even more, should it be applied today? and yes, i am also asking if women can be priests/ministers/preachers/cardinals/bishops/witch doctors/scientology grand poobahs and if not, y u so narrow minded?
Originally posted by ZahlanziNo the context make it clear that Paul is talking of order, verse 33 states, God is a God of order, therefore what he is referring to is a congregational arrangement whereby men are to shoulder the responsibility of teaching, and a women is free to speak and teach under this arrangement.
the bible is clear. a woman must be silent in church and not presume to teach others.
now i ask again. do you agree with this assessment or not? even more, should it be applied today? and yes, i am also asking if women can be priests/ministers/preachers/cardinals/bishops/witch doctors/scientology grand poobahs and if not, y u so narrow minded?
It cannot be understood to be a complete ban on women talking or teaching, for such a stance contradicts the Bible elsewhere, for example that Christians of both sexes are to come together for an interchange of encouragement, if a women was to literally remain silent this could not be the case and as is demonstrated elsewhere, she is to impart knowledge through a public ministry. What is therefore wrong here is your or anyone else's insistence that this is a blanket prohibition against women teaching or voicing their knowledge in the congregation, such a position is at odds with the immediate passage and is at odds with the rest of the Bible. what Paul is referring to is simply a congregational arrangement whereby qualified men are to shoulder the responsibility and all others can impart knowledge under this arrangement but not usurp it.
Women cannot be elders, the arrangement as Paul states is restricted to males only and only those which qualify by meeting the standards set out in scripture. Now i suggest before you go on a rampage that this is the Biblical arrangement, you can either accept it or not, either way, it is what it is.
24 Jan 14
Originally posted by robbie carrobieWhat a load of old tosh.
no the context make it clear that Paul is talking of order, verse 33 states, God is a God of order, therefore what he is referring to is a congregational arrangement whereby men are to shoulder the responsibility of teaching, and a women is free to speak and tech under this arrangement. It cannot be understood to be a complete ban on women talking o ...[text shortened]... ricted to males only and only those which qualify by meeting the standards set out in scripture.
'It is disgraceful for a women to speak in the church'.
You could not get a more clear and unambiguous instruction.
24 Jan 14
Originally posted by Proper KnobI have provided reason and reference that its not possible for the verse to be viewed in such black and white terms, i repeat not possible, to take a verse in isolation and offer up a perspective on the basis of isolation is pure skulduggery!
What a load of old tosh.
'It is disgraceful for a women to speak in the church'.
You could not get a more clear and unambiguous instruction.
Originally posted by darvlayIt cannot be understood to be a complete ban on women talking or teaching, for such a stance contradicts the Bible elsewhere, for example that Christians of both sexes are to come together for an interchange of encouragement, Hebrews 10, to view a verse in isolation and draw conclusions without reference to the immediate context and the context of the Bible as a whole is more narrow minded than the meanest medieval monk, but hey, why let that stop you.
Seriously.
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24 Jan 14
Originally posted by robbie carrobiea bit like the out of context quote of mine you have on your profile.............pure skulduggery, some might even cry hypocrisy.
I have provided reason and reference that its not possible for the verse to be viewed in such black and white terms, i repeat not possible, to take a verse in isolation and offer up a perspective on the basis of isolation is pure skulduggery!
24 Jan 14
Originally posted by robbie carrobieThe verse is quite clear. Women should remain silent 'in the church'. Failure to do so would be a 'disgrace', as I pointed out this is quite clear and unambiguous.
I have provided reason and reference that its not possible for the verse to be viewed in such black and white terms, i repeat not possible, to take a verse in isolation and offer up a perspective on the basis of isolation is pure skulduggery!
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24 Jan 14
Originally posted by robbie carrobieis there a passage that says its disgraceful for men to talk in church?
It cannot be understood to be a complete ban on women talking or teaching, for such a stance contradicts the Bible elsewhere, for example that Christians of both sexes are to come together for an interchange of encouragement, Hebrews 10, to view a verse in isolation and draw conclusions without reference to the immediate context and the context of th ...[text shortened]... as a whole is more narrow minded than the meanest medieval monk, but hey, why let that stop you.