Problems with Jehova's witnesses

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
i am sure you make a perfectly great nominal Christian, you can determine for yourself what is morally acceptable and what is not, you can advocate evolution in direct opposition to the teaching of Christ, you can spout sensationalistic diatribe which ignores evidence and statement of fact, you can give vent to your prejudices, all in all, your half ...[text shortened]... h no basis other than your ignorance and prejudice. i wish you well with your knew found faith.

Yes, perhaps i will be the perfect christian. But that is not my goal.

A direct question to you, rc: If your sister is going to die, and the only thing that can save her life is a blood transfusion... Do you rather let her die than give her an blood transfusion?

If your answer is "Yes, she would rather die if I have any saing in the matter." then I have to rethink my opinion that you have the right to chose your cult freely. If so, then JW cult should be outlawed.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Yes, perhaps i will be the perfect christian. But that is not my goal.

A direct question to you, rc: If your sister is going to die, and the only thing that can save her life is a blood transfusion... Do you rather let her die than give her an blood transfusion?

If your answer is "Yes, she would rather die if I have any saing in the matter." then I ...[text shortened]... ion that you have the right to chose your cult freely. If so, then JW cult should be outlawed.

look Fabian , this is the last time i shall state this to you, what is it about the right of self determination that you do not understand? i have no say in what my sister does with her own body. do you understand that? that is why it is termed the principle of Self determination, with the emphasis on self. if you do not understand the philosophical argument, go away and look it up, you shall be better informed and just may learn something in the process rather than uttering this nonsensical diatribe.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
look Fabian , this is the last time i shall state this to you, what is it about the right of self determination that you do not understand? i have no say in what my sister does with her own body. do you understand that? that is why it is termed the principle of Self determination, with the emphasis on self. if you do not understand the philosophi ...[text shortened]... rmed and just may learn something in the process rather than uttering this nonsensical diatribe.

So your answer is clearly "Yes, I let her die!"

She lies there on the road after a traffic accident bleading heavily. The ambulance comes, having fresh blood to give her but you say no. The paramedics tell you that if she doesn't have new blood in her veins very soon she is going to die. You cannot ask your sister if she wants to die rather to have a blood transfusion, she is unconscious, you have to decide for her.

And you say to the paramedics: "Well, guys, we are Jehovas Witnesses, so we are at a higher moral level than you are. We are of the beliefs that even if we can save her life, we wont, because of principles. We are good people so we let people die rather than commit a sin. We live by the bible so we let people die. I know that 99.999% of the population would gladly save their sister in a similar situation, but we are the (very) few who are rightful in this. Death is better for her. I've chosen for her. Let her die!"

And you call yourself a true christian?

There should be a law against this...

Oh just listen to yourselves, this whole religion lark is a total fiasco. Just admit it, none of us have the slightest idea about God or ourselves in relationship to Him. We can't agree about if He exists or what we are supposed to be doing about it either way, so just forget it and go get some fresh air or a beer or something, anything.

If there is a God do you really think He would appreciate you squandering your gift (life) on a chess website forum? He would probably be wondering why he ever bothered in the first place and I wouldn't blame Him.

It's a nice day outside if you wrap up warm.

Originally posted by josephw
... The JW's worship the wrong Jesus.. .

Im sure readers of this forum will know that I am against much of the JW doctrine and I intend to expose some of their teachings which are contrary to the teachings of Christ.... but this statement Josephw, is childish and irresponsible.

Jesus is the Son of God who came to die for mans sins so that he will have a chance to inherit eternal life. The JWs worship the same Jesus Christ. Your statement implies that no JW will get salvation as they dont even know who Christ is. It is as stupid and irresponsible a statement as the ones some JWs make that only JWs will get salvation.

Originally posted by Rajk999
Im sure readers of this forum will know that I am against much of the JW doctrine and I intend to expose some of their teachings which are contrary to the teachings of Christ.... but this statement Josephw, is childish and irresponsible.

Jesus is the Son of God who came to die for mans sins so that he will have a chance to inherit eternal life. The JWs wo ...[text shortened]... stupid and irresponsible a statement as the ones some JWs make that only JWs will get salvation.

How about an honest, civil conversation about the points you disagree with us on. Just one at a time so it can be fully researched and explained and not lost in a multi point jumbled up conversation? Also no name calling if you can.

Originally posted by galveston75
How about an honest, civil conversation about the points you disagree with us on. Just one at a time so it can be fully researched and explained and not lost in a multi point jumbled up conversation? Also no name calling if you can.

Dont you think we have covered them all in the threads in the last 6 months or so?

Originally posted by Rajk999
Dont you think we have covered them all in the threads in the last 6 months or so?

Not to your satisfaction I'm sure...

Originally posted by galveston75
How about an honest, civil conversation about the points you disagree with us on. Just one at a time so it can be fully researched and explained and not lost in a multi point jumbled up conversation? Also no name calling if you can.

Galveston, I've ask robbie a question, and he was honest enough to answer it truthfully, even if it hurt his reputation.

I would like to ask you the same question. Would you like me to repeat the question, or do you find it yourself?

So what is your honest answer? Would you save your sister or would you let her die?

Originally posted by FabianFnas
So your answer is clearly "Yes, I let her die!"

She lies there on the road after a traffic accident bleading heavily. The ambulance comes, having fresh blood to give her but you say no. The paramedics tell you that if she doesn't have new blood in her veins very soon she is going to die. You cannot ask your sister if she wants to die rather to have a b ...[text shortened]... die!"

And you call yourself a true christian?

There should be a law against this...

Fabian it is plainfuly obvious you do not now anything about either the right of self determination, nor of medical science. Until you shall cure yourself of your ignorance and instead of spouting diatribe, make an educated and informed evaluation of your words, i have absolutely nothing more to say to you, for this is now my third attempt to get you to educate yourself, yet you seem to relish in darkness. If you wish to know the correct medical procedure during an emergency with heavy blood loss,for those who wish to claim the right of self determination, i suggest you look it up. I do not have either the time nor the inclination to deal with such a woefully ignorant person. You remain in your original prejudiced state, for it is comfortable for you to fire pathetic emotionally charged cyber rockets from your cave of darkness. i wish you well for i have seen enough of your kind to last a lifetime.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Galveston, I've ask robbie a question, and he was honest enough to answer it truthfully, even if it hurt his reputation.

I would like to ask you the same question. Would you like me to repeat the question, or do you find it yourself?

So what is your honest answer? Would you save your sister or would you let her die?

only those who are foolish enough to swallow your diatribe are giving any credence to your empty words, I for one believe that persons have minds of their own and can easily see through your emotionally charged rhetoric. My reputation remains intact for i am both knowledgeable and sensible enough to know the type of person i am dealing with.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Galveston, I've ask robbie a question, and he was honest enough to answer it truthfully, even if it hurt his reputation.

I would like to ask you the same question. Would you like me to repeat the question, or do you find it yourself?

So what is your honest answer? Would you save your sister or would you let her die?

Wether it be a blood trans or whatever medical wishes she had, especially if those wishes were in writing in a Medical Directive, that is the wish I would honor.

Originally posted by Rajk999
Im sure readers of this forum will know that I am against much of the JW doctrine and I intend to expose some of their teachings which are contrary to the teachings of Christ.... but this statement Josephw, is childish and irresponsible.

Jesus is the Son of God who came to die for mans sins so that he will have a chance to inherit eternal life. The JWs wo ...[text shortened]... stupid and irresponsible a statement as the ones some JWs make that only JWs will get salvation.

The deity of Christ is a cardinal doctrine. The Holy Spirit reveals the Truth of God's Word to the believer. If one denies the teaching of scripture, i.e. Jesus is God in the flesh, then that one doesn't know the Jesus of the Bible.

They may know what the Bible teaches concerning many things about Jesus, but denying that Jesus is God means one doesn't KNOW the real Jesus.

Originally posted by josephw
The deity of Christ is a cardinal doctrine. The Holy Spirit reveals the Truth of God's Word to the believer. If one denies the teaching of scripture, i.e. Jesus is God in the flesh, then that one doesn't know the Jesus of the Bible.

They may know what the Bible teaches concerning many things about Jesus, but denying that Jesus is God means one doesn't KNOW the real Jesus.

what if you are wrong? and you have not been a recipient of the holy spirit and God has not revealed to you the true nature of Christ?

How in fact is it possible to see God, for the scripture indicated that no man has seen God at any-time? but plenty of people saw Jesus Christ. How is it possible for God to die? for Christ came in order that he may die and give his life. It is well know that God did not have a beginning, but has always existed, yet the scriptures indicate that Christ was the first-born, or the only begotten son. This could not be possible if he has always existed. Thus it seems to me, that you cannot have been the recipient of Holy spirit otherwise you would not equate God with Christ due to the above biblically established reasons, for the Bible itself is a product of Holy spirit. Infact, i would be as bold as to state that rather than these being the product of Holy spirit, they are just the usual Church dogma that has not changed for hundreds of years, and because of adherence to a tradition you have made the word of God, a product of Holy spirit, invalid.

(Matthew 15:6-7) . . .And so you have made the word of God invalid because of your tradition.

Originally posted by josephw
The deity of Christ is a cardinal doctrine. The Holy Spirit reveals the Truth of God's Word to the believer. If one denies the teaching of scripture, i.e. Jesus is God in the flesh, then that one doesn't know the Jesus of the Bible.

They may know what the Bible teaches concerning many things about Jesus, but denying that Jesus is God means one doesn't KNOW the real Jesus.

I fully understand.

The JWs think you are hopelessly lost becuase your doctrine is false.
Your kind thinks the JWs are hopelessly lost becuase their doctrine is false.

Do you think its possible that you are both wrong?