1. Standard membermenace71
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    14 Dec '09 06:561 edit
    While I respect the JW's here are problems.

    1. Denial of who Christ really is namely God.

    2. Denial of the Holy Spirit also being God.

    3. Believing that abstaining from certain foods or drink will make them holy.

    4. Blood issue not being able to comprehend the difference between a blood
    transfusion and actually eating or drinking blood. two different things.

    5. The organization itself in regards to it's past. Not being truthful. While most of
    this is public record. It's ok to criticize & scrutinize the Christian church but not
    the mighty watch tower organization.

    6. The "Awake magazine" one issue will state a certain doctrine that the JW's
    believe then a later issue will recant the doctrine. Then they will go back on
    this doctrine in a later issue. This is all public record and can be researched for
    yourself. Would you trust an organization that can't even keep what they believe
    straight? The Christian church has believed the same thing for 2000 years.

    7. The JW's twist scripture to fit their doctrines. So much so that they came up
    with their very own translation. This translation has even been altered by them.
    They can't keep their own translation straight. Early editions of the New world
    translation will read different from later versions. This is also public record and
    can be proven.

    8. I can go on & on but I think the point is made.

    Manny
  2. Joined
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    14 Dec '09 07:52
    Originally posted by menace71
    While I respect the JW's here are problems.

    1. Denial of who Christ really is namely God.

    2. Denial of the Holy Spirit also being God.

    3. Believing that abstaining from certain foods or drink will make them holy.

    4. Blood issue not being able to comprehend the difference between a blood
    transfusion and actually eating or drinking blood. t ...[text shortened]... and
    can be proven.

    8. I can go on & on but I think the point is made.

    Manny
    are they the ones that believe that jesus was nailed on a pole instead of a cross and that only 144000 people will get to heaven?
  3. Standard membermenace71
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    14 Dec '09 08:07
    Indeed yes.







    Manny
  4. Standard membermenace71
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    14 Dec '09 08:121 edit
    While I respect the JW's here are problems.

    1. Denial of who Christ really is namely God.

    2. Denial of the Holy Spirit also being God.

    3. Believing that abstaining from certain foods or drink will make them holy.

    4. Blood issue not being able to comprehend the difference between a blood
    transfusion and actually eating or drinking blood. two different things.

    5. The organization itself in regards to it's past. Not being truthful. While most of
    this is public record. It's ok to criticize & scrutinize the Christian church but not
    the mighty watch tower organization.

    6. The "Awake magazine" one issue will state a certain doctrine that the JW's
    believe then a later issue will recant the doctrine. Then they will go back on
    this doctrine in a later issue. This is all public record and can be researched for
    yourself. Would you trust an organization that can't even keep what they believe
    straight? The Christian church has believed the same thing for 2000 years.

    7. The JW's twist scripture to fit their doctrines. So much so that they came up
    with their very own translation. This translation has even been altered by them.
    They can't keep their own translation straight. Early editions of the New world
    translation will read different from later versions. This is also public record and
    can be proven.

    8. That only 144,000 will make it to heaven.





    Manny
  5. Joined
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    14 Dec '09 08:15
    Originally posted by menace71
    While I respect the JW's here are problems.

    1. Denial of who Christ really is namely God.

    2. Denial of the Holy Spirit also being God.

    3. Believing that abstaining from certain foods or drink will make them holy.

    4. Blood issue not being able to comprehend the difference between a blood
    transfusion and actually eating or drinking blood. two dif ...[text shortened]... but I think the point is made.

    9. That only 144,000 will make it to heaven.

    Manny
    i am not sure that is the exact number though. but less than 150000 anyway. kinda like an elite upper class of nobles ruling over the "lesser" christians left on a new and improved earth or something.
  6. Standard membermenace71
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    14 Dec '09 08:201 edit
    I admit I wanted to get ole R.C. & G75 all fired up. There coming trust me 🙂 They will be gunning for me.




    Manny
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    14 Dec '09 08:34
    Originally posted by menace71
    I admit I wanted to get ole R.C. & G75 all fired up. There coming trust me 🙂 They will be gunning for me.




    Manny
    masochist!
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    14 Dec '09 08:42
    Originally posted by menace71
    8. That only 144,000 will make it to heaven.
    So when they knock on my door and want me to join the cult of theirs, then I should ask for a membership number less than 144 000 in order to make it worthwhile?
  9. Account suspended
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    14 Dec '09 09:361 edit
    for Manny,

    Sorry to disappoint you Manfred, these things have been discussed at great length on the forum and if you want to believe that Jesus Christ is God, that the Holy Spirit is part of a triune God then that's entirely up to you, but you must respect that not everyone shares your belief.

    Also i must point out your inaccuracy, as is so often the case when one quotes from a third party, they clearly do not understand, nor have taken the time to actually try to ascertain what our beliefs are and why we profess them, for we do not profess that by abstaining from certain foods or liquids that it shall make us any more 'holy', than he next man, sorry to disappoint, but i do not know where you sourced you information, for it is clearly erroneous.

    (Romans 14:17-18) . . .For the kingdom of God does not mean eating and drinking, but means righteousness and peace and joy with holy spirit.  For he who in this regard slaves for Christ is acceptable to God and has approval with men.

    here is just one verse which highlights your errm 'inaccuracy', (we shall not call it a lie quite yet) ,

    firstly we can see that Paul states adherence to a certain ritualistic code of what one eats and what one does not eat has practically no value in regard to the Kingdom of God (you do know what the Kingdom of God is , dont you?), for it is a matter of conscience.

    i had also better clarify, why fasting may be acceptable, on an individual basis, for we hold that if anyone feels the necessity to fast, simply to have clarity of thought, not that it shall make a person more Holy, a person may wish, based on an individual basis and concerning the dictates on conscience, to fast. There is of course a Biblical precedence for this.

    Lastly this verse shows the absurdity of accepting the Hoy Spirit as a personage, for quite clearly it is the exercise of Gods inanimate force , which causes a person, in this instance, to experience peace and joy.

    (Galatians 5:22-24) . . .On the other hand, the fruitage of the spirit is love, joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faith,  mildness, self-control. Against such things there is no law.
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    14 Dec '09 09:412 edits
    Originally posted by FabianFnas
    So when they knock on my door and want me to join the cult of theirs, then I should ask for a membership number less than 144 000 in order to make it worthwhile?
    firstly we are not a cult, never have been a cult, have no charismatic leader other than Jesus Christ, and our meetings are held in public, advertised publicly, through a public ministry, for members of the public. Get the point?

    Actually unless you have a very high moral standard you cannot become one of Jehovahs witnesses, that includes living with someone to whom you are not married, smoking tobacco, taking drugs, drinking alcohol to excess, any predisposition towards violence, member of the armed forces etc etc etc. i somehow dont think that you would make the mark Fabian, sorry to disappoint, but standards are standards.
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    14 Dec '09 09:51
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    firstly we are not a cult, never have been a cult, have no charismatic leader other than Jesus Christ, and our meetings are held in public, advertised publicly, through a public ministry, for members of the public. Get the point?

    Actually unless you have a very high moral standard you cannot become one of Jehovahs witnesses, that includes living ...[text shortened]... ont think that you would make the mark Fabian, sorry to disappoint, but standards are standards.
    Don't worry, rc, I have no intention to be a member of your cult. I'd rather be christian.
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    14 Dec '09 10:01
    Originally posted by FabianFnas
    Don't worry, rc, I have no intention to be a member of your cult. I'd rather be christian.
    Lol, its not so hard, just give up frequenting gay bars, get married (to a woman) and you should be ok 😛
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    14 Dec '09 10:18
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    Lol, its not so hard, just give up frequenting gay bars, get married (to a woman) and you should be ok 😛
    No, I don't frequent the same places where you go, I don't want to risc to see you there.
  14. England
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    14 Dec '09 11:02
    Originally posted by menace71
    While I respect the JW's here are problems.

    1. Denial of who Christ really is namely God.

    2. Denial of the Holy Spirit also being God.

    3. Believing that abstaining from certain foods or drink will make them holy.

    4. Blood issue not being able to comprehend the difference between a blood
    transfusion and actually eating or drinking blood. t ...[text shortened]... and
    can be proven.

    8. I can go on & on but I think the point is made.

    Manny
    on the first point, christ never said he was god but god was his father. why would he pray father who art in heaven if he was hear on earth. he was the son of god given the gold crown .
    2 they do have problems with the spirit but its still not god the father but the holy spirit who works what god wants doing and neither put themselves above the living god.
    if they want to practice this why not even if i disagree i do not see any harm in it
    the taking of blood is meant to be killing someone but they take it to the letter, [RC BELIVE that the bread transforms to the acutal body of christ]
    i read the watch tower regular i have disagreed on many points but when on this site do all agree debate is the foundation
    thier understanding of heaven may be flawed but the 144,000 is the saints etc who washed there souls in the glory of christ, the rest of us will be judged between sheep and goats
  15. SubscriberProper Knob
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    14 Dec '09 11:05
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    Lol, its not so hard, just give up frequenting gay bars, get married (to a woman) and you should be ok 😛
    'I'm not in the slightest bit homophobic, honest?!'
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