Scientific Proof of God

Originally posted by Penguin
I hadn't thought of option 3!

Imagining option 4 gives me the impression that it is actually a 'no free will' situation.

--- Penguin

The way I understand it is that you are supposed to use you apparent "Earthly free will" to allign with "Gods will" , Upon which you are supposed to be freed from your mortal bonds and reunite with your True/Higher Self.


As always at this point I cant go on because I have noticed that only a very few posters seems to understand my understanding of "God". Not that my word is final by any means - it takes all of us to put our pieces of the "Great Jigsaw Puzzle" into place.

And when we come to notions of "True Self" or "Higher Self" , we muddy the waters even more, as waves of crossed and mixed up views start to form, and , hopefully some one with a decent sense of humour will post something to relieve the tension that is sometimes accosiated with talking about "heavy" stuff.

(A big part of the problem is our misunderstanding of linguistics. I know that in a higher dimension ,(heaven), there is no conflict and hence there is no need for concepts such as "higher"" , or "heavier" ,etc. As to what awaits I couldn't put it into words, and even that would be the slightest of glimpses.)

Originally posted by karoly aczel
The way I understand it is that you are supposed to use you apparent "Earthly free will" to allign with "Gods will" , Upon which you are supposed to be freed from your mortal bonds and reunite with your True/Higher Self.


As always at this point I cant go on because I have noticed that only a very few posters seems to understand my understanding of ...[text shortened]... uldn't put it into words, and even that would be the slightest of glimpses.)

I say you are just talking out of your arse.

Originally posted by RJHinds
I say you are just talking out of your arse.

So? No one cares what you think.

did you ever think to actually take me up on some of my points, perhaps using scripture as some sort of debating device, or whatever?

If you think that you can just keep repeating the same thing and convince people that that you have your finger on the "truth" then you are more far-gone than I thought.

Originally posted by Penguin
[b]Proof of God DOES negate Free Will.

Then there must be no free will in heaven (or we are just as much in the dark about God in heaven as we are here on earth, as TWhitehead said)

How so? Not following your "logic" here.

Satan must have had free will in order to rebel against God. Satan had proof of God and yet also had free will. Ther ...[text shortened]... s in the sky into a message from him in every language on the planet. Simples.

--- Penguin.[/b]

Oh good grief. Do I really have to hold your hand and talk you through what I meant? It seems obvious on the face of it.

Free Will is only an option for those who have not already made their choice. For those who have made their choice, seeing God appear before them is not going to change their mind. Those who hate God will still hate God, those who love God will still love God. Incontrovertible proof of God will only negate the Free Will of those who have not already chosen. I thought that was fairly obvious. God cannot prove Himself to those who have not made their choice because it negates their Free Will. Those who have already chosen have already exercised their Free Will. It cannot be negated, they've already exercised it. Furthermore, those who have chosen God do not need further proof of His existence, and those who have chosen against God do not deserve proof of His existence.

Originally posted by karoly aczel
So? No one cares what you think.

did you ever think to actually take me up on some of my points, perhaps using scripture as some sort of debating device, or whatever?

If you think that you can just keep repeating the same thing and convince people that that you have your finger on the "truth" then you are more far-gone than I thought.

I use scripture all the time, where have you been?

Originally posted by Suzianne
Oh good grief. Do I really have to hold your hand and talk you through what I meant? It seems obvious on the face of it.

Free Will is only an option for those who have not already made their choice. For those who have made their choice, seeing God appear before them is not going to change their mind. Those who hate God will still hate God, those who ...[text shortened]... of His existence, and those who have chosen against God do not deserve proof of His existence.

Does god know what choice an individual will make?

Originally posted by OdBod
Does god know what choice an individual will make?

Only if he chooses to.

There's a point, does god have free will? Can he choose to do something other than all this prophesy malarkey? Suppose he says "Hang all that rubbish in Revelation, I fancy a holiday in the next galaxy", is there anything to stop him just buggering off and leaving us to get on with it?

Originally posted by RJHinds
I use scripture all the time, where have you been?

All the time? even in your last post to me on this forum? Plllease ...

I was pleased when I saw this thread, If DNA and the periodic table are 'divine' then there is almost nothing to argue about....

On DNA being proof of god welll, hmmm. But carbon does have strange properties compared to all the other elements, in chemistry you have inorganic (the periodic table) and organic (carbon based) chemistry, carbon is so versatile it takes up half the subject. There are some who think its is almost like its designed for creating life...

Originally posted by RJHinds
Satan the devil, and the third of the angels, now called demons, that he convinced to join him in his rebellion against God proves there is free will in Heaven. So try again. 😏

Satan the devil, and the third of the angels, now called demons,

What passage in the Bible says that the angels that rebelled against God are demons ?

Originally posted by RJHinds
That is stupid to have faith in something without proof. Certainly you can have faith that the Sun will appear in the east every morning because of proof that it has done so in the past. You apparently think of faith as jumping off a high mountain with only the belief that you will land safely. A faith of stupidy.

seeing is not belive you dont need prife to belive

Originally posted by lavadragonheart
seeing is not belive you dont need prife to belive

Many people believe in evil-lution without seeing the proof. So there is not a requirement to see anything as proof to believe something. However, I consider it stupid to put one's faith in something without at least some sort of convincing proof. Just seeing a magic trick that convinces one that something is true is more logical to me than seeing nothing at all.

Originally posted by RJHinds
Many people believe in evil-lution without seeing the proof. So there is not a requirement to see anything as proof to believe something. However, I consider it stupid to put one's faith in something without at least some sort of convincing proof. Just seeing a magic trick that convinces one that something is true is more logical to me than seeing nothing at all.

Many people believe in a bunch of inconsistent fairy tales without any proof of them being true. I think you are mixing up evidence and proof. You will find it difficult to prove any scientific theory or any religious idea but you can find evidence for or against. I suggest you try to find some evidence instead of blathering on about non-existent proofs.

Originally posted by sonship

Satan the devil, and the third of the angels, now called demons,

What passage in the Bible says that the angels that rebelled against God are demons ?

I don't recall if there is an actual statement saying "demons are rebelled angels", but I figured it out using logic. Everything God made was good in the beginning and since Lucifer (Satan) was the first rebellious angel and is called the devil, because he is ruler over the remaining rebellious angels, who are also called devils or demons, because of their torment of humans.