Originally posted by KellyJay
Both, it is a serious gift of God, and people play at it and are just
putting it on. Within scripture there are several gifts of tongues
one was used in Acts where every man heard the various people
speaking in their native language about the things of God, there
is one gift that someone gets a message from God and another
will interpret it to the grou ...[text shortened]... hat need to be
prayed for. If you want scripture references I'll look them up for
you.
Kelly

How does the notion of speaking in tongues mesh with your assertion in another thread regarding the Bible being God's communication with us and therefore written in a way we can understand? Why does god send messages to people in a language that nobody but an interpreter can understand?

TheSkipper

Originally posted by TheSkipper
How does the notion of speaking in tongues mesh with your assertion in another thread regarding the Bible being God's communication with us and therefore written in a way we can understand? Why does god send messages to people in a language that nobody but an interpreter can understand?

TheSkipper

Could it be something like? JESUS CHRIST taught and lived as an example on how Mankind was to live. Yet today many still do not understand, what HE said, or done.

Originally posted by blindfaith101
Could it be something like? JESUS CHRIST taught and lived as an example on how Mankind was to live. Yet today many still do not understand, what HE said, or done.

Look, I quoted KellyJay because I wanted a reasonably intelligent response. While Kelly and I disagree on many things, maybe even most, I consider him to be sincere and thoughtful which makes communicating with him enjoyable in spite of the fact that he is wrong about almost everything. 😉

You, on the other hand, are not at all interesting to communicate with because you are dogmatic, repetitive and thoughtless. In fact, and I mean this, I do not think you are a real person. I think you are the brainchild of an atheist (or something) and using the Blindfaith101 pseudonym to poke fun at religious people. I think it is funny and an interesting expression of oneself but I prefer to watch your antics rather than engage in them with you.

Good day.

TheSkipper

Originally posted by TheSkipper
How does the notion of speaking in tongues mesh with your assertion in another thread regarding the Bible being God's communication with us and therefore written in a way we can understand? Why does god send messages to people in a language that nobody but an interpreter can understand?

TheSkipper

It was never my assertion in any thread that the Bible was in any
way simple, it is very complex in my opinion; moreover, without
the Spirit of God you will not even grasp some of the deeper
spiritual meanings within scripture. Praying in the Spirit, is God
praying through you, saying the things that need said. God knows
and understands, and at times we will have someone who can
and does interpret the message for the whole body so that we
all get something out of it the same way as when prophetic
message is given to the body.
Kelly

edit: Sorry I was thinking of another post I responded to as I read
yours, and sort of mix the two. I mean to say that God does use
words we can understand within scripture, He will not say day and
mean century as He is relating a story on how long something took
to do, with prayer in the Spirit it isn't us that the language is being
directed too, but God Himself, and God does understand.
My bad, sorry!

Originally posted by TheSkipper
Look, I quoted KellyJay because I wanted a reasonably intelligent response. While Kelly and I disagree on many things, maybe even most, I consider him to be sincere and thoughtful which makes communicating with him enjoyable in spite of the fact that he is wrong about almost everything. 😉

You, on the other hand, are not at all interesting to communic ...[text shortened]... ut I prefer to watch your antics rather than engage in them with you.

Good day.

TheSkipper

🙂
Kelly

Originally posted by blindfaith101
THE HOLY SPIRIT does not live within someone who denies CHRIST.

$200 says you couldn't tell the difference.

Originally posted by telerion
$200 says you couldn't tell the difference.

I agree with you, unless God gives that knowledge it is just people
speaking.
Kelly

Originally posted by sasquatch672
Whew. That's alot to digest at once. Especially the part where "speaking in tongues" has an acronym.

Okay. Now, I can honestly say that when I was confirmed at 18, I had a very moving and spiritual experience. I really did feel that I was in the presence of God. No kidding. I also have felt moments of calmness after receiving the Eucharist ...[text shortened]... quoted that "SIT was for people who didn't know how or what to pray for..." - Matthew 6:6-13.

Let's see if I can clear up/answer some of what you are saying. I probably wasn't very articulate since this is an extensive topic.

Okay. Now, I can honestly say that when I was confirmed at 18, I had a very moving and spiritual experience. I really did feel that I was in the presence of God. No kidding. I also have felt moments of calmness after receiving the Eucharist. I felt more spiritually in touch and plugged in.

I was raised Catholic too. I had a "1st Communion" and was also "Confirmed" along with years of "Religous Ed." I strayed away from it because at the time I only went because I was "persuaded" by my parents. As soon as I was of age I lost interest. I don't remember an experience though.

But I have a really, really hard time believing in this "speaking in tongues" business. I think that there are some extremely religious communities where individual members of the congregation, in order to draw attention to themselves, begin willfully and voluntarily mouthing words and making sounds that they later attribute to having "spoken in tongues". I think that people are faking. I think they do it to gain the admiration of other members of their congregation. I have never, ever, ever seen someone begin to speak in tongues in the middle of a Catholic liturgy - or, for that matter, at any Catholic ceremony. I've also been to non-denominational, Jewish, Presbyterian, Episcopalian, and Baptist events. At no time did I ever, ever see someone being to speak in tongues.

I am not at all surprised that you are having a difficult time believing that SIT is genuine. I don't think the Catholic Church supports it's use, I could be wrong. And yes there are etremists everywhere, but if they SIT out of order, that cannot be helped. Every one is accountable for their own actions. And there are probably some who "fake" it as well. But I think it is hard to do.
There are many denominations such as you mention that believe SIT was done away with during the 1st Century Church.

Follow my logic here. All of the Christian denominations whose ceremonies I've attended believe that because they believe in Christ as Savior, they themselves are on the road to heaven. So really, while there may be minor and even major differences in philosophy, they all believe the one essential thing - that Christ died for our sins. So then it would follow that Jesus doesn't favor one Christain denomination over the other, because they all believe in the same basic essential tenets of faith. So then, speaking in tongues, if it truly occurred anywhere, should occur everywhere, because the beliefs are basically the same.

Not really. I don't think God honors any denomination. He honors people who believe His word and believe it to the extent that they obey or do what it says. He honors "doers" of His word, there are many listeners.

Don't you find it odd that charismatic churches exist, almost exclusively, in rural, isolated communities with low levels of income and education among their members? And this "speaking in tongues" - well, if God was going to communicate with us, wouldn't He do it in a way we could understand? Why would He do it in a way that no one understands?

I don't think what you are saying is true. I know of many successful and high income people who SIT. As far as the SIT for God to communicate with us is all wrong. I never said that. God communicates to us through His word primarily. He can speak directly to you through your mind if He wants to. That is not the purpose of SIT. Perhaps these verses will help explain what SIT is primarily for....


Rom 8:16
16 The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,
(NKJ)

Self explanatory.

1 Cor 14:2
2 For he who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God, for no one understands him; however, in the spirit he speaks mysteries.
(NKJ)

Notice even the speaker does not know.

1 Cor 14:4
4 He who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but he who prophesies edifies the church.
(NKJ)

SIT edifies the speaker..."builds him/her up."

{b]1 Cor 14:17
17 For you indeed give thanks well, but the other is not edified.
(NKJ)[/b]

SIT is giving of thanks perfectly, and there are many more benefits.
Sometimes I am awakened at night and have a strong urge to pray. But I don't know for what. But the "spirit" of God residing in me knows. So I "pray in the spirit"(SIT).

No serious person ACTUALLY believes that speaking in tongues is in effect the taking over of a person's body by the Holy Spirit and then subsequent uttering of some obscure language. Right?

Right! God NEVER takes over anyones body or will. When I SIT it is because I choose to do so. Sometimes I want to praise God for some reason or other and can't find satisfactory words...so I SIT.

If someone were going to speak in tongues - if the Holy Spirit were going to pick a person as a conduit to speak to the rest of us - being the all-knowing God that He is, wouldn't He want us to understand Him? Wouldn't He really send a messenger that we all understood? Wouldn't someone actually speak in Aramaic, Hebrew - one of the languages of the Bible?

Of couse he would say it a language all understand. Again, that is not the purpose of SIT. Please reread my posts. SIT is designed for private prayer use only. In a church setting ONE person, if inspired to do so can SIT then MUST interpret. Never two at a time. It is to be done decently and in order. It must not interupt a sermon or anyone. In my church the minister will call on one or two people to SIT and interpret. The interpretation is "inspiration" not "revelation". Some who SIT AND MUST interpret or someone called on to prophecy is usually an inspired believer. That is, some one who studies much, is a doer and is full of joy and excited about the things of God.

I think this speaking in tongues business is really people who are looking for attention. Small towns, bored people, very religious community, overactive imaginations. People decide, in a moment of emotion, to throw themselves on the ground and then start making noises. Personally, I can't think of anything more embarrassing.

Sigh...I understand your feelings. But I assure you it is not what you think. People do not "throw themselves on the ground". This isn't SIT.
You must have been to a church that was totally out of order. I'm sorry. You should read 1st Corinthians 14 keeping in mind what I am saying.

EDIT: You mentionoed in the post I quoted that "SIT was for people who didn't know how or what to pray for..." - Matthew 6:6-13



Rom 8:26
26 Likewise the Spirit also helps in our weaknesses. For we do not know what we should pray for as we ought, but the Spirit Himself makes intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
(NKJ)

"uttered" here means unspeakable or not understood.

Originally posted by TheSkipper
Look, I quoted KellyJay because I wanted a reasonably intelligent response. While Kelly and I disagree on many things, maybe even most, I consider him to be sincere and thoughtful which makes communicating with him enjoyable in spite of the fact that he is wrong about almost everything. 😉

You, on the other hand, are not at all interesting to communic ...[text shortened]... ut I prefer to watch your antics rather than engage in them with you.

Good day.

TheSkipper

Then you should not conversate with me or read any of my posts.

Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
Then I don't follow your position. Please, for the record:

Is the Bible written so that even the simple minded can understand it?

Does blindfaith101 misunderstand it, regarding the matter of speaking in tongues?

Is blindfaith101 at least simple minded, if not reasonably intelligent?

How can you coherently answer Yes to all of these?

Easy. The bible is written so that even a simple minded person like myself can understand it. I had another thread about the "skeptic" who will have a tough time understanding it.
BF101 had different teachers than I did. So I cannot speak for him. The bible or anything of God, will reward an individual, depending on what he puts into it. Here is another teaser... God will only reveal as much or as little as He pleases, depending on the individual. He looks at the heart. He cannot be fooled. Our intellect does not impress Him.
There are some Christians that "appear" to know more than others, but don't be fooled by this either. The body of Christ or His church is made up of many members that excel in different areas. Some are good at teaching, some are good at giving, some at comforting, some at encouraging, etc.etc.
Perhaps BF101 has little or less understanding of SIT than someone else, but he has done the greater thing....he believed and received and so manefested. So, as I said, God is not impressed with intellect nor does He ignore the simple of mind...in either case He is glorified.
And I am not saying BF101 is simple either...perhaps he just does not articulate as he would like.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
Easy. The bible is written so that even a simple minded person like myself can understand it. I had another thread about the "skeptic" who will have a tough time understanding it.
BF101 had different teachers than I did. So I cannot speak for him. The bible or anything of God, will reward an individual, depending on what he puts into it. Here is anoth ...[text shortened]... d I am not saying BF101 is simple either...perhaps he just does not articulate as he would like.

Is the Bible written so that even the simple minded can understand it?

Does blindfaith101 misunderstand it, regarding the matter of speaking in tongues?

Is blindfaith101 at least simple minded, if not reasonably intelligent?


Keep it simple for me with Yes or No answers, please.

Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
Is the Bible written so that even the simple minded can understand it?

Does blindfaith101 misunderstand it, regarding the matter of speaking in tongues?

Is blindfaith101 at least simple minded, if not reasonably intelligent?


Keep it simple for me with Yes or No answers, please.

Is the Bible written so that even the simple minded can understand it?
Yes

Does blindfaith101 misunderstand it, regarding the matter of speaking in tongues?
I think so.

Is blindfaith101 at least simple minded, if not reasonably intelligent?
It's not my place to say either way...I don't know enough about him. And even if I did, I would not answer a question like that.