21 Feb 10
I was watching a documentary last night about a facility in Phoenix,
Arizona, where like 70 persons are cryogenically frozen. Besides
many other thoughts, questions and ideas I got about those persons,
a question keeps coming back to me: where are their souls?
Are they in heaven but when they get defrosted the soul will come
back? Is their soul trapped in their frozen body? Do their souls
wander around like ghosts until the situation of the person's body is
finally solved?
Your thoughts on the matter are appreciated.
21 Feb 10
Originally posted by SeitseActually Sietse, the whole person is 'the soul'. In Biblical terms it simply means a living breathing creature. Animals are also described as being souls. What leaves the body at death, is not some conscious entity, but the life force which animated the person. This shall upset a lot of people, but it is Biblically substantiated.
I was watching a documentary last night about a facility in Phoenix,
Arizona, where like 70 persons are cryogenically frozen. Besides
many other thoughts, questions and ideas I got about those persons,
a question keeps coming back to me: where are their souls?
Are they in heaven but when they get defrosted the soul will come
back? Is their soul trappe ...[text shortened]... uation of the person's body is
finally solved?
Your thoughts on the matter are appreciated.
21 Feb 10
Originally posted by SeitseI don't know.
I was watching a documentary last night about a facility in Phoenix,
Arizona, where like 70 persons are cryogenically frozen. Besides
many other thoughts, questions and ideas I got about those persons,
a question keeps coming back to me: where are their souls?
Are they in heaven but when they get defrosted the soul will come
back? Is their soul trappe ...[text shortened]... uation of the person's body is
finally solved?
Your thoughts on the matter are appreciated.
I doubt if after defrosting any of them will be alive.
21 Feb 10
Originally posted by robbie carrobieLife force?
Actually Sietse, the whole person is 'the soul'. In Biblical terms it simply means a living breathing creature. Animals are also described as being souls. What leaves the body at death, is not some conscious entity, but the life force which animated the person. This shall upset a lot of people, but it is Biblically substantiated.
The Bible clearly describes man as having a spirit, soul, and body. That is the whole man. It doesn't just say we are a living soul. The soul is who we are. Our identity. The soul gives us self consciousness. The body gives us world consciousness. Our spirit gives us God consciousness.
But don't worry about it. I was a Christian for over 20 years before I began to learn and understand this truth.
21 Feb 10
3 edits
Originally posted by josephwoh dont worry about it, i have yet to meet a nominal Christian who knows what he is talking about. You are no exception. Adam was not given a soul, he became a soul, after god infused the breath of life into him. Let me tell you in five minutes what it has taken you twenty years not to understand.
Life force?
The Bible clearly describes man as having a spirit, soul, and body. That is the whole man. It doesn't just say we are a living soul. The soul is who we are. Our identity. The soul gives us self consciousness. The body gives us world consciousness. Our spirit gives us God consciousness.
But don't worry about it. I was a Christian for over 20 years before I began to learn and understand this truth.
In the Bible, “soul” is translated from the Hebrew nephesh and the Greek psykhe. Bible usage shows the soul to be a person or an animal or the life that a person or an animal enjoys. It is not the same as spirit, and it is mortal.
Gen. 2:7: “Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul.” (Notice that this does not say that man was given a soul but that he became a soul, a living person.) (The part of the Hebrew word here rendered “soul” is nephesh. KJ, AS, and Dy agree with that rendering. RS, JB, NAB read “being.” NE says “creature.” Kx reads “person.&rdquo😉
1 Cor. 15:45: “It is even so written: ‘The first man Adam became a living soul.’ The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.” (So the Christian Greek Scriptures agree with the Hebrew Scriptures as to what the soul is.) (The Greek word here translated “soul” is the accusative case of psykhe. KJ, AS, Dy, JB, NAB, and Kx also read “soul.” RS, NE, and TEV say “being.&rdquo😉
1 Pet. 3:20: “In Noah’s days . . . a few people, that is, eight souls, were carried safely through the water.” (The Greek word here translated “souls” is psykhai, the plural form of psykhe. KJ, AS, Dy, and Kx also read “souls.” JB and TEV say “people”; RS, NE, and NAB use “persons.&rdquo😉
Gen. 9:5: “Besides that, your blood of your souls [or, “lives”; Hebrew, from nephesh] shall I ask back.” (Here the soul is said to have blood.)
Josh. 11:11: “They went striking every soul [Hebrew, nephesh] that was in it with the edge of the sword.” (The soul is here shown to be something that can be touched by the sword, so these souls could not have been spirits.)
Gen. 1:20, 21, 24, 25: “God went on to say: ‘Let the waters swarm forth a swarm of living souls* . . . ’ And God proceeded to create the great sea monsters and [/b]every living soul[/b] that moves about, which the waters swarmed forth according to their kinds, and every winged flying creature according to its kind. . . . And God went on to say: ‘Let the earth put forth living souls according to their kinds . . . ’ And God proceeded to make the wild beast of the earth according to its kind and the domestic animal according to its kind and every moving animal of the ground according to its kind.” (*In Hebrew the word here is nephesh. Ro reads “soul.” Some translations use the rendering “creatures.&rdquo😉
Lev. 24:17, 18: “In case a man strikes any soul [Hebrew, nephesh] of mankind fatally, he should be put to death without fail. And the fatal striker of the soul [Hebrew, nephesh] of a domestic animal should make compensation for it, soul for soul.” (Notice that the same Hebrew word for soul is applied to both mankind and animals.)
Rev. 16:3: “It became blood as of a dead man, and every living soul died, yes, the things in the sea.” (Thus the Christian Greek Scriptures also show animals to be souls.) (In Greek the word here is psykhe. KJ, AS, and Dy render it “soul.” Some translators use the term “creature” or “thing.&rdquo😉
so unless our identity can be struck with a sword, is an animal, is a fish, survived the great flood, had the breath of life infused into it, is mortal, carries blood etc etc you have some explaining to do. On the cited scriptures if you please.
21 Feb 10
Originally posted by robbie carrobieYou're mincing words. And you are ignoring a great deal more of the scriptures.
oh dont worry about it, i have yet to meet a nominal Christian who knows what he is talking about. You are no exception. Adam was not given a soul, he became a soul, after god infused the breath of life into him. Let me tell you in five minutes what it has taken you twenty years not to understand.
In the Bible, “soul” is translated from the Heb ...[text shortened]... eath of life breathed into it, is mortal, carries blood etc etc you have some explaining to do.
God first created a body. There was a body first. Then God breathed into the nostrils the breath of life. Adam became a living soul after the breath of life was breathed into the nostrils of the body that was created.
2 Corinthians 5:8 - We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
If, as you say, the soul and body are one and the same, how then is it that we know that when we are absent from the body we are with the Lord?
Your problem is what you accuse me of having a problem with. You are fixated on a doctrinal perspective ingrained in you by man made institutions.
I'm beyond that.
21 Feb 10
2 edits
Originally posted by josephwyes and you also seem to beyond the ability to reason on a few biblical verses as well, but hey, it only took you five minutes and not twenty years to find that out, you should be thankful. It is clearly evident that the soul is a living breathing entity, whether human or animal, if you can refute this, then let the forum know. As for accusations of indoctrination, well, at least i can explain my beliefs which at present seems to be quite beyond you, despite your pretensions of transcendence.
You're mincing words. And you are ignoring a great deal more of the scriptures.
God first created a body. There was a body first. Then God breathed into the nostrils the breath of life. Adam became a living soul after the breath of life was breathed into the nostrils of the body that was created.
2 Corinthians 5:8 - We are confident, I say, and wil ...[text shortened]... ted on a doctrinal perspective ingrained in you by man made institutions.
I'm beyond that.
21 Feb 10
Originally posted by robbie carrobieDang! You got my number.
yes and you also seem to beyond the ability to reason on a few biblical verses as well, but hey, it only took you five minutes and not twenty years to find that out, you should be thankful. It is clearly evident that the soul is a living breathing entity, whether human or animal, if you can refute this, then let the forum know. As for accusations ...[text shortened]... beliefs which at present seems to be quite beyond you, despite your delusions of transcendence.
I should have realised the superiority of your knowledge of the scriptures. Now all I can do is run away with my tail between my legs.
Just because you can quote a few verses and babble about some Greek and Hebrew words doesn't mean a thing if you don't understand the truth. The Bible can be made to say just about anything any apostate wants it to say.
You don't know what you're talking about robbie. You don't even know who Jesus is. You only know what you've been told by other misbelievers pretending to know what the Bible means by what others have told them. It's obvious.
21 Feb 10
Originally posted by josephwWhat a lovely bunch you Christians are.
Dang! You got my number.
I should have realised the superiority of your knowledge of the scriptures. Now all I can do is run away with my tail between my legs.
Just because you can quote a few verses and babble about some Greek and Hebrew words doesn't mean a thing if you don't understand the truth. The Bible can be made to say just about anything an ...[text shortened]... vers pretending to know what the Bible means by what others have told them. It's obvious.
For people who supposedly have the love of Jesus Christ flowing through them, you're just a gaggle of bickering tarts.
21 Feb 10
Originally posted by josephwsorry Joe i am not going to get any more personal with you, if you have anything of relevance to say on the subject let it be heard, otherwise i have no time for any more unsubstantiated claims.
Dang! You got my number.
I should have realised the superiority of your knowledge of the scriptures. Now all I can do is run away with my tail between my legs.
Just because you can quote a few verses and babble about some Greek and Hebrew words doesn't mean a thing if you don't understand the truth. The Bible can be made to say just about anything an ...[text shortened]... vers pretending to know what the Bible means by what others have told them. It's obvious.
21 Feb 10
3 edits
Originally posted by Proper Knobshut it, your next! 😛
What a lovely bunch you Christians are.
For people who supposedly have the love of Jesus Christ flowing through them, you're just a gaggle of bickering tarts.
actually Noobster what you are witnessing happens all the time, someone makes a point without knowing what they are talking about despite their pretensions, when someone else points out the inconsistency of their point of view, they get defensive and being devoid of reasoning resort to the only avenue open to them, personal accusation. i was bored once somewhere and read it in a management book under the subsection, anatomy of an argument. Its amazing what you will read when you are bored.
21 Feb 10
Originally posted by robbie carrobieWhat do you think the collective noun should be for 'bickering Christians'?
shut it, your next! 😛
actually Noobster what you are witnessing happens all the time, someone makes a point without knowing what they are talking about despite their pretensions, when someone else points out the inconsistency of their point of view, they get defensive and being devoid of reasoning resort to the only avenue open to them, personal accusation.