The Fear Of God

Hell.

It's like this thread, it keeps going and going, and going.

And guess what, you all created it. 😠

Originally posted by whodey
Hell.

It's like this thread, it keeps going and going, and going.

And guess what, you all created it. 😠

It's interesting though how you have danced around the definition of "evil" that you asked me for. A fair few of the wasted, prolong-the-thread posts are yours. 🙂

Originally posted by FMF
It's interesting though how you have danced around the definition of "evil" that you asked me for. A fair few of the wasted, prolong-the-thread posts are yours. 🙂

Sin is evil, evil is lack of faith in God. Lack of faith in God stems from not having the love of God in your heart.

Adam is our first example. Here we have paradise on earth, but Adam is tempted and sins. It seems like a frivolous sin to us, but then it led to Cain, and then Cain led to Noah's flood. An interesting fact in Genesis is that men lived to be about a 1000 years old before the flood, but after the flood God only allowed men to live to around 120 years. Why? The text does not say, but I think the message here is, sinful man, if he were allowed to live longer, would make hell on earth for all.

So how is sin and its subsequent suffering to be expunged? I would think it would have to involve the willing. Those that choose God's love will be those that escape and those that thumb their nose up at it, will not.

The only other alternative would be to strip us all of our free will, something that a God of love cannot do because a mutually loving relationship demands the freedom to love or reject the other.

Of course, I've reasoned all this out in my head, but the bottom line is that I have faith in God. I tend to shy away from questioning the Almighty, as Adam did before me. I trust that he is loving and he is just. I suppose the only other alternative would be to end my life like Joe Stalin, waving his fists at the heavens to a God that he denied existed.

Will the most murderous man in recorded history rest in peace whom lived in the lap of luxury? Is God just?

Originally posted by whodey
Sin is evil, evil is lack of faith in God. Lack of faith in God stems from not having the love of God in your heart.

Having different beliefs from those that you have is "evil"?

Originally posted by whodey
So how is sin and its subsequent suffering to be expunged? I would think it would have to involve the willing. Those that choose God's love will be those that escape and those that thumb their nose up at it, will not.

Why is that so many people are able to live morally sound lives even though they don't feel a "fear of God"?

Originally posted by FMF
Why is that so many people are able to live morally sound lives even though they don't feel a "fear of God"?

Morally sound by whose standards, yours?
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
Morally sound by whose standards, yours?

By the standards of the neighbourhoods, communities and societies in which people live and, in my case, my adherence (and the adherence of those I live among) to the three simple moral principles (which I believe humans are hard wired to value and observe) that I laid out earlier. These standards underpin many of the important laws of the land where I live too. I believe I live a morally sound life and do so without a "fear of God" factor. Do you, for instance, believe you only live a morally sound life because of your religious beliefs?

Originally posted by FMF
By the standards of the neighbourhoods, communities and societies in which people live and, in my case, my adherence (and the adherence of those I live among) to the three simple moral principles (which I believe humans are hard wired to value and observe) that I laid out earlier. These standards underpin many of the important laws of the land where I live too. ...[text shortened]... you, for instance, believe you only live a morally sound life because of your religious beliefs?

So you compare us by us, we are the guiding scale for your morals?
Hard to go wrong when you are your own standard, but what if we are
not the end all be all of morals?
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
So you compare us by us, we are the guiding scale for your morals?
Hard to go wrong when you are your own standard, but what if we are
not the end all be all of morals?
Kelly

If it's only Hebrew mythology and the literature that set its offshoot in motion that is stopping you from acting immorally then that is a bit arbitrary "too" if you ask me; but if that's the only way you can lead a morally sound life [assuming that you do] then I suppose ... ~ well, yes, you go for it ~ whatever it takes. So I acknowledge your need for and dependence on that literature, but I ask again, why is that so many people are able to live morally sound lives even though they don't feel the "fear of God" that you just so happen to feel?

Originally posted by FMF
Why is that so many people are able to live morally sound lives even though they don't feel a "fear of God"?

Why have faith FMF?

It is because you acknowledge your own short comings when it comes to knowing what is best for you. When God warns us about something, something that we may think is good, but he knows it is not, we should listen and shun it.

Of course, this is combined with the belief that God is not just all knowing, he is benevolent as well.

Originally posted by whodey
Why have faith FMF?

It is because you acknowledge your own short comings when it comes to knowing what is best for you. When God warns us about something, something that we may think is good, but he knows it is not, we should listen and shun it.

Of course, this is combined with the belief that God is not just all knowing, he is benevolent as well.

An answer to my question would be of more interest to me.

Originally posted by FMF
By the standards of the neighbourhoods, communities and societies in which people live and, in my case, my adherence (and the adherence of those I live among) to the three simple moral principles (which I believe humans are hard wired to value and observe) that I laid out earlier. These standards underpin many of the important laws of the land where I live too. ...[text shortened]... you, for instance, believe you only live a morally sound life because of your religious beliefs?

There is an old saying, "The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

I think we all can provide examples. That's why placing your faith in a God who is good and is all knowing is vital. He is righteous. He provided us with a sense of right and wrong, but we also still need him to guide us.

Originally posted by FMF
An answer to my question would be of more interest to me.

By whose standards do people live "good" lives?

I'm sure many would argue that both you and I don't live "good" lives. I'm sure there are those who would just assume lop off our heads because we don't adhere to their set of beliefs.

Originally posted by whodey
Of course, this is combined with the belief that God is not just all knowing, he is benevolent as well.

And for a person not subscribing to the belief that the God figure you happen to believe in "is not just all knowing, he is benevolent as well", the punishment is being tortured for eternity in burning agony, that is your theological view, right?

Originally posted by whodey
By whose standards do people live "good" lives?

I'm sure many would argue that both you and I don't live "good" lives. I'm sure there are those who would just assume lop off our heads because we don't adhere to their set of beliefs.

The lopping off of heads to punish unbelief pales into insignificance beside the sheer scale of the doctrine of eternal torture to punish unbelief. There is absolutely no reason to subscribe to either of these depraved religionist ideologies.