The Gospel as God's Need

God living in man is not to crowd man out of himself. It is to MINGLE with man. It is to be INCORPORATED in man in a blended way - to produce a God-Man.

God has this need since the creation of the universe. That is He seeks, as the Apostle Paul wrote - "a dwelling place of God in spirit".


" ... you ... being built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the cornerstone; In whom all the building, being fitted together, is growing into a holy temple in the Lord;

In whom you also are being built together into a dwelling place of God in spirit." (Eph. 2:20-22)

Jesus Christ - the Godman, the Son of God, the Son of Man is the "cornerstone" of this building. The building is growing as God is dispensing Himself into His redeemed people. He is growing and building up a habitation of God in spirit, a dwelling place where divinity and humanity are mingled together for His rest and glory and man's enjoyment.

Praise the Lord indeed !

Originally posted by avalanchethecat
You're probably not going to like me agreeing with you, but that's what I got from Jesus' teachings too. A lot of christians seem to overlook this simple message in their eagerness to worship their creed.

What I post in this forum are the direct words of Christ, Paul and the Apostles. I don't post interpretations, impressions or opinions, neither do I ever direct anyone to the teachings of this author or that author. The only authors who can give us salvation are Christ and the Apostles.

So if you agree with me you agree with them as well. In effect you are a believer in Christ. Almost no Christian here, teaches the important doctrines of Christ, and that is a sad reflection of the state of Christianity today. They all have their own agenda and dogma to adhere to like you said. Christianity has gone astray and is corrupt, greedy and selfish. The love which Christ preached is wiped off from their teachings.

Jaywill and his nonsense in this thread is a good example. Knightmesiter is his other threads is another joker, and these threads are an insult to the true teachings of the Bible.

Originally posted by Rajk999
What I post in this forum are the direct words of Christ, Paul and the Apostles. I don't post interpretations, impressions or opinions, neither do I ever direct anyone to the teachings of this author or that author. The only authors who can give us salvation are Christ and the Apostles.

So if you agree with me you agree with them as well. In effect you ar ...[text shortened]... r threads is another joker, and these threads are an insult to the true teachings of the Bible.

What I post in this forum are the direct words of Christ, Paul and the Apostles. I don't post interpretations, impressions or opinions, neither do I ever direct anyone to the teachings of this author or that author.

Maybe that is your weakness. Did you not read that Paul said that he gave his opinion on a matter ?

"Now concerning virgins I have no commandment of the Lord, but I give [my] opinion as one who has been shown mercy by the Lord to be faithful" (1 Cor. 7:25)

Today, this of Paul's opinion, is part of the word of God.

I am not saying we are all writing the word of God. I am saying that I am not impressed by you stating you don't give your opinion. It sounds good. But the Apostle Paul gave his opinion here, and followed it with "But she is more blessed if she so remains, according to my opinion; but I think that I also have the Spirit of God." (v.40)

In the new testament God wroughts Himself into our personalities so that even our opinions can be edifying to the believers. A superspiritual grandstanding that "I do not give opinions but am only a tape recorder repeating back what the Bible said" sounds good.

I also repeat back the Scripture, to most poster's annoyance in fact. I also may give my feeling and opinion. I think I also have the Spirit of God as Paul said he thought he had the Spirit of God.

I do not claim to be writing Scripture other than my quotations of what has already been written.

As for refering to others ? Peter refered to Paul. Jesus refered to prophets. The Gospel writers refered to other Old Testament writers.

Paul refered even to heathen poets on Mars Hill.

Jude refers to an apochralphal book of Enoch which was not even in the canon of the Bible.

Members of the Body of Christ may refer to other members of the Body of Christ. Refering to the study of those who have done more indepth research over a longer period of time can be helpful at times. It is NOT wrong in and of itself to refer to other teachers. And it seems very proud and individualistic of you to insist that you would never do it.

I have pointed to where MORE study can be had. And I will continue to do so if the feeling arises. And I will do so without the slightest sense of shame, thankyou.

I may ever refer someone to something you wrote. You never know. But for me to post a good link -

www.godseconomy.org or www.regenerated.net is a problem to you, that's too bad. It is helpful to refer people to trusted authors who can tell them more and perhaps tell them better.

The only authors who can give us salvation are Christ and the Apostles.

Praise the Lord that Christ is salvation.

It is silly to assume becausee of this we cannot be edified by testimony of others, teaching of others, witnessings of others.

And for all your boasting that you only refer to the words of Christ and His Apostles you haven't done much of a job to refute the assurance of eternal salvation as it is taught by Christ and His apostles.

So if you agree with me you agree with them as well. In effect you are a believer in Christ. Almost no Christian here, teaches the important doctrines of Christ,

"Me and ME ONLY" huh ??

You and Elijah - "Lord, I am the ONLY ONE left down here."

God had seven thousand reserved that Elijah didn't even know about.
We may have different emphasises here. We may have different styles.
We may have different levels of maturity and skill in writing.
I'd rejoice to know someone is better at this testifying to Jesus than I. And I think some actually are.

I don't think its ONLY you Rajk999 and you ONLY, that can talk well about the Gospel.

and that is a sad reflection of the state of Christianity today. They all have their own agenda and dogma to adhere to like you said. Christianity has gone astray and is corrupt, greedy and selfish. The love which Christ preached is wiped off from their teachings.

I agree with much of this. I think in many ways you are a continuation of the "sad" state of Christianity.

You seem not to be clear about the laying the foundation of the Christian life in an assurance of eternal redemption:

Jaywill and his nonsense in this thread is a good example. Knightmesiter is his other threads is another joker, and these threads are an insult to the true teachings of the Bible.

This thread is not nonsensical. It makes a lot of sense. Perhaps you have eyes to see and see not. There is an angle to the Gospel from the standpoint of God's Need.

If you feel better now, I will go back to the OP and the subject of this thread.
Thanks for any attempts at constructive contributions.

Originally posted by jaywill
.. Thanks for any attempts at constructive contributions.[/b]

The more you write the more readers are seeing your own arrogance and self-righteousness.

Originally posted by jaywill
.. There is an angle to the Gospel from the standpoint of God's Need.

There is no such angle in the Bible. Posters have tried to tell you of the difference between needs and wants. Its a very basic difference.

God WANTS man to worship him.
God does NOT NEED man to worship him.

God is in the business of creating and destroying. God certainly has created other civilizations on this Earth before Adam. God destroyed the world minus 8 people when he was displeased with what he created. God quite likely has created thousands of other worlds in other parts of the universe. Your mind is small Jaywill. God does not need man. Man needs God. God can create people of his liking whenever he pleases. The Jews were similarly arrogant and thought God needed them and that they were so special. Christ said to them ..

Matt 3:9 And do not think to say within yourselves, We have a father, Abraham. For I say to you that God is able to raise up children to Abraham from these stones.

Originally posted by Rajk999
There is no such angle in the Bible. Posters have tried to tell you of the difference between needs and wants. Its a very basic difference.

God WANTS man to worship him.
God does NOT NEED man to worship him.

God is in the business of creating and destroying. God certainly has created other civilizations on this Earth before Adam. God destroyed the w ...[text shortened]... raham. For I say to you that God is able to raise up children to Abraham from these stones. [/i]

There is no such angle in the Bible. Posters have tried to tell you of the difference between needs and wants. Its a very basic difference.

Really?

Look at the parable of the prodigal son, or, I like to say, the loving father. When the son comes home from the pigs, ill clothed and hungry, prepared to only be his father's hired servant and no longer his son, see the father's reaction ?

Please read this portion.

"But when he came to himself, he said, How many of my father's hired servants abound in bread, but I am perishing here in famine ! I will rise up and go to my father, and I will say to him, Father, I have sinned against heaven and before you. I am no longer woethy to be called your son; make me like on of your hired servants.

And he rose up and came to his own father. But while he was still a long way off, his father saw him and was moved with compassion, and he ran and fell on his neck and kissed him affectioniately." (See Luke 15:17-20)

Do you see how Jesus portrays the old father running, filled with compassion and joy that his lost son has returned home ? Do you say that this father had no need ?


This is the parable of the Lord Jesus Christ. In the ancient near east it was undignified for an old man to run. The scene of the old father running and falling compassionately on the neck of his returned son, kissing him with joy is very touching. Can you honestly say that the father in this parable had no need ?

He needed his long lost child to return to him. This parable shows the Gospel of Christ from the stanpoint of God's need. Don't you think so ?

Yes, no doubt the son was in need also. But the meeting of the son's need was also and even more the meeting of the longing father's need.

In fact, the JOY that the repentant sinner feels deep within is a reflection of the JOY of the Heavenly Father that we have come HOME, COME HOME ! The need was so great that the Son of God came to DIE to meet the NEED of the loving and longing Father.

God WANTS man to worship him.
God does NOT NEED man to worship him.

Look again at the parable. The father wants the son to be CLOTHED and to EAT and to be BEAUTIFIED with a golden ring.

"But the father said to his slaves, Bring out quickly the best robe and put it on him, and put a ring on his hand and sandals on his feet.

And bring the fattened calf; slaughter it, and let us eat and be merry, Because this son of mine WAS DEAD AND LIVES AGAIN; HE WAS LOST AND HAS BEEN FOUND.

And they began to be merry." (Luke 15:22-24)


There is not the tone of the father demanding the son to prostrate himself to the ground in adoration. In this parable there is no tone of the father wanting worship. The father needs to uplift the glory of the lost son. The father needs to FEED and CLOTH the son. The father needs to express his merry rejoicing that the father's NEED has been met at long last.

More latter.

Originally posted by jaywill

There is no such angle in the Bible. Posters have tried to tell you of the difference between needs and wants. Its a very basic difference.

Really?

Look at the parable of the prodigal son, or, I like to say, the loving father. When the son comes home from the pigs, ill clothed and hungry, prepared to only be his father's hired ...[text shortened]... s merry rejoicing that the father's NEED has been met at long last.

More latter.

The reason for your false teachings is very simple. You cannot tell the difference between ..

YOUR OWN PERSONAL OPINION AND INTERPRETATION

AND

CLEAR FACTS FROM THE BIBLE.

Originally posted by Rajk999
The reason for your false teachings is very simple. You cannot tell the difference between ..

YOUR OWN PERSONAL OPINION AND INTERPRETATION

AND

CLEAR FACTS FROM THE BIBLE.

And what in the world do you suppose is the purpose of this forum? Hmmmm?

Maybe "personal opinion and interpretation"?

I daresay jaywill is a better witness for Christ than someone like you, who says, in effect, "If it's not in the Bible, then it's not true!" This is the failing of the JW's as well.

The Christian walk is not about a set of rules in a book where you toe the line, or perish. It is about what is written on your heart. Clearly, Christ knew this to be true. Clearly, you do not. I see much lip service being given in this forum by Christians to the idea of the value of one having love for their Christian brothers. But not very much actual love.

Originally posted by Suzianne
.. The Christian walk is not about a set of rules in a book where you toe the line, or perish.

And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
(2 Thessalonians 1:7-9)

Obey Christ or perish.

Obey Christ = following his commandments.

Christ will judge. Not you.

As for presenting opinions as facts, thats the start of apostasy an false doctrines.

Originally posted by Rajk999
There is no such angle in the Bible. Posters have tried to tell you of the difference between needs and wants. Its a very basic difference.

God WANTS man to worship him.
God does NOT NEED man to worship him.

God is in the business of creating and destroying. God certainly has created other civilizations on this Earth before Adam. God destroyed the w ...[text shortened]... raham. For I say to you that God is able to raise up children to Abraham from these stones. [/i]

God is in the business of creating and destroying. God certainly has created other civilizations on this Earth before Adam. God destroyed the world minus 8 people when he was displeased with what he created. God quite likely has created thousands of other worlds in other parts of the universe. Your mind is small Jaywill. God does not need man. Man needs God. God can create people of his liking whenever he pleases. The Jews were similarly arrogant and thought God needed them and that they were so special. Christ said to them ..

Matt 3:9 And do not think to say within yourselves, We have a father, Abraham. For I say to you that God is able to raise up children to Abraham from these stones.

Let me make myself clear. I do not disagree with God being all-sufficient, self sufficient, and self existing from eternity. On one hand you are right.

As a student of the Bible we learn not only what the Bible says. We learn again, what else the Bible says. There is another angle. That is God's seeking the solution to His need.

In Genesis we read that God rested on the seventh day. I don't beleive this is a resting because of exhaustion or weariness. I believe it is a resting because of satisfaction. God obtains for Himself a creation and man as the deputy authority having His image and appointed dominion of His creation.

You may say "This is only God's desire. This is not God's need." Maybe so. Maybe the difference is negligible. I think it is okay to speak of the need of God.

Hannah the praying mother of Samuel told God that she would lend her child to the Lord all the days of his life. That was the prophet Samuel, a splendid man of God.

Did Hannah sense that God had a need ? (See First Samuel chapter 1).

Originally posted by jaywill
[quote] God is in the business of creating and destroying. God certainly has created other civilizations on this Earth before Adam. God destroyed the world minus 8 people when he was displeased with what he created. God quite likely has created thousands of other worlds in other parts of the universe. Your mind is small Jaywill. God does not need man. Man n ...[text shortened]... be so. Maybe the difference is negligible. I think it is okay to speak of the need of God.

What utter rubbish !

This was Hannah's prayer:

"And she made a vow and said, O Jehovah of hosts, if You will indeed look upon the affliction of Your female servant and remember me and not forget Your female serrvant, but give to Your female servant a male child, then I WILL GIVE HIM TO JEHOVAH for all the days of his life, and no razor will come upon his head." (1 Sam. 1:11)


Hannah says when Samuel is born - "Therefore I, for my part, have lent him to Jehovah; all the days that he lives, he is lent to Jehovah" (v.28)


Would you have been like Hannah Rakj999? Or would you have said in your heart "God doesn't NEED anything." ?

Hannah felt in her heart that God was in need of a consecrated man, a prophet to serve God all the days of his life. She gave her baby boy to God. She lent him to God "all the days of his life."

Was not God's need met by the life of the prophet Samuel ? I would say, Yes indeed. What a profit to God to have had Samuel the prophet. And how much the more when the king Saul that Israel asked for went so terribly wrong.

Sure God had a need. And Hannah realized how deep that need of God was and consecrated the answer to her prayer for a child, to God.

Answer me Rajk999. If you had been Hannah would you have said "God Does Not NEED ANYTHING." ?

Or would you have had the desire to lend the child to Jehovah God all the days he lives ?

Answer for us. Which do you think was more noble and according to the will of God, for Hannah to sense God's need or to assume God had NO NEEDS ?

Originally posted by Rajk999
[quote]And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
(2 Th ...[text shortened]... ot you.

As for presenting opinions as facts, thats the start of apostasy an false doctrines.

You conveniently leave out the rest of what I was saying. I said:

"The Christian walk is not about a set of rules in a book where you toe the line, or perish. It is about what is written on your heart."

It is about what is written on your heart. If you are filled with the love of God and the love of your fellow man, you will naturally follow Christ's commandments. You are guilty of what you are accusing jaywill of doing. You're putting your own spin on the issue.

Remember that even though adultery was against the law and the usual result was stoning for the guilty, still Jesus said to the adultress, "Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more." (John 8:11) He read what was written on the woman's heart. This is one of the greater lessons of John, but it appears to have slipped your mind in your zeal to have people follow out of fear, rather than love.

You know, of course, that Jesus also commanded us to love our neighbor, and to show love for our Christian brothers. And yet here you condemn jaywill for solidly witnessing for Christ. You also call jaywill arrogant, and yet you judge him, and then turn around and say, "Christ will judge. Not you." I say your focus has become far too narrow and you've lost sight of what is truly important about Christ's teachings.

I'll say it again. It is NOT the rule of law. It IS what is written on your heart. This is clear to anyone except perhaps those who are letting their personal agenda or credo bind them in a straitjacket of their own creation. Please, for the love of God, do not delude yourself into thinking that only you know the correct path. Jesus himself would not approve of you holding your own personal Inquisition here.