1. Standard memberRajk999
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    09 Jan '18 11:293 edits
    Q : How do you know if you belong to the truth, and if the love of God is in you?
    A : Charity.

    If we are rich and see others in need, yet close our hearts against them, how can we claim that we love God? My children, our love should not be just words and talk; it must be true love, which shows itself in action. This, then, is how we will know that we belong to the truth; this is how we will be confident in God's presence. (1 John 3:17-19 GNB)

    All people who practice this charitable love, will enter the Kingdom of God.
    All others will be cast out.
  2. SubscriberSuzianne
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    09 Jan '18 11:34
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    Q : How do you know if you belong to the truth, and if the love of God is in you?
    A : [b]Charity.


    [i]If we are rich and see others in need, yet close our hearts against them, how can we claim that we love God? My children, our love should not be just words and talk; it must be true love, which shows itself in action. This, then, is how we will kno ...[text shortened]... who practice this charitable love, will enter the Kingdom of God.
    All others will be cast out.[/b]
    Republican evangelicals, are you listening?
  3. SubscriberFMF
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    09 Jan '18 11:43
    Originally posted by @suzianne
    Republican evangelicals, are you listening?
    Do you believe that 'Republican' Christians and 'Democrat' Christians can have an honest and understandable ~ and principled ~ disagreement over the role of the individual and the role of government in collecting and using money for charitable purposes ~ without having to decry or denounce one another's Christian principles?
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    09 Jan '18 11:59
    Originally posted by @suzianne
    Republican evangelicals, are you listening?
    Funny how you think that if you render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's you are carrying out your responsibility to help the poor.

    You really are a misguided individual.

    Paying taxes, killing unborn humans and sexual immorality...this is your definition of a christian.
  5. SubscriberFMF
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    09 Jan '18 12:07
    Originally posted by @eladar
    Funny how you think that if you render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's you are carrying out your responsibility to help the poor.
    Can paying taxes - some of which will be used for charitable purposes - not, at least, be a part of carrying out your responsibility to help the poor?
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    09 Jan '18 12:31
    Originally posted by @fmf
    Can paying taxes - some of which will be used for charitable purposes - not, at least, be a part of carrying out your responsibility to help the poor?
    No
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    09 Jan '18 13:13
    Originally posted by @eladar
    No
    Let’s generalize this. Can a group of people have a legitimate right to set up rules that anyone who wants the benefits of being a member of the group, must follow? Can one of these rules require giving to a fund that helps support people that the group’s elected leadership identifies as being in need? This is without calling it “charity.”
  8. SubscriberFMF
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    09 Jan '18 13:33
    Originally posted by @js357
    Can one of these rules require giving to a fund that helps support people that the group’s elected leadership identifies as being in need? This is without calling it “charity.”
    This touches on an important point. By charity here I was referring to the help that 'poor people', for example, receive, and not referring to the compulsory handing over of money to an authority, which is arguably not 'charitable' giving.
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    09 Jan '18 13:331 edit
    Originally posted by @js357
    Let’s generalize this. Can a group of people have a legitimate right to set up rules that anyone who wants the benefits of being a member of the group, must follow? Can one of these rules require giving to a fund that helps support people that the group’s elected leadership identifies as being in need? This is without calling it “charity.”
    The Bible is a bit more complex than mere action and a bit more complex than helping generically the poor.

    If a person simply will not work, that person should not eat.

    Suzi will claim that no such people exist but the Bible says there are. Who are we to believe?
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    09 Jan '18 13:556 edits
    Originally posted by @eladar
    The Bible is a bit more complex than mere action and a bit more complex than helping generically the poor.

    If a person simply will not work, that person should not eat.

    Suzi will claim that no such people exist but the Bible says there are. Who are we to believe?
    I believe there are people who get by by scamming other people. This happens among the rich as well as the poor, if not more so among the rich at least in the amounts scammed. However, it is you who have oversimplified this to “if a person simply will not work.” Even the scammer works, he works his scam. Be it Donald Trump reneging on contracts or some cardboard-bearing begger playing on your heartstrings on a traffic island, you can justify your callousness either way. Do you give a few bucks on the street? Or vote for making ‘Murrica great again? Which scam hurts more?

    Edit: [/rant]
  11. Standard memberdj2becker
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    09 Jan '18 16:471 edit
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    Q : How do you know if you belong to the truth, and if the love of God is in you?
    A : [b]Charity.


    [i]If we are rich and see others in need, yet close our hearts against them, how can we claim that we love God? My children, our love should not be just words and talk; it must be true love, which shows itself in action. This, then, is how we will kno ...[text shortened]... who practice this charitable love, will enter the Kingdom of God.
    All others will be cast out.[/b]
    What about someone who runs a prostitution ring or deals drugs, but is also charitable in order to put up appearances and soothe their conscience? Will they enter the Kingdom of God?
  12. Standard memberRajk999
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    09 Jan '18 17:08
    Originally posted by @dj2becker
    What about someone who runs a prostitution ring or deals drugs, but is also charitable in order to put up appearances and soothe their conscience? Will they enter the Kingdom of God?
    Jesus will know the answer to these things.
    Im just posting what Jesus and the Apostles said.

    What I can tell you is that charitable works done for show for personal gain or as you say for appearances, are not good works according to Christ. But Im not surprised, you scarcely know what Jesus preached at all.
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    09 Jan '18 17:15
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    Jesus will know the answer to these things.
    Im just posting what Jesus and the Apostles said.

    What I can tell you is that charitable works done for show for personal gain or as you say for appearances, are not good works according to Christ. But Im not surprised, you scarcely know what Jesus preached at all.
    What if you just really, really, really love everyone but are otherwise just too lazy to put in the work?
    I'm asking for a friend, of course.
  14. Standard memberRajk999
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    09 Jan '18 17:24
    Originally posted by @freakykbh
    What if you just really, really, really love everyone but are otherwise just too lazy to put in the work?
    I'm asking for a friend, of course.
    Tell your friend that laziness is also a sin, and that charitable or brotherly love transforms someone into a doer of good works. There are no exceptions
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    09 Jan '18 17:36
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    Tell your friend that laziness is also a sin, and that charitable or brotherly love transforms someone into a doer of good works. There are no exceptions
    Sadly, the salvation you espouse relies far too much on the efforts of man... that "far too much" is meant to mean: anything at all... in order for it to be truly of God.
    It's His plan, and His plan is perfect.
    It doesn't rely one iota on any effort, any possible strain toward effort on behalf of man.
    His plan called for His work.
    That work included the final nail in the coffin, if not the final act.
    What Christ did on the cross was sufficient for all loss, all debt.
    He removed the flesh from the question and boiled it down to one solitary thought:
    What think ye of the Christ?
    Anything more is not the thing, anything less is neither.

    Your cart before the horse will transport you nowhere near where you clearly wish to go.
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