Originally posted by @apathist I guess my problem here is the idea that a feeling of purpose is in some way possibly false.
Well, whether the feeling of purpose is invested in something real or unreal is a matter of religious conviction/faith ~ but the feeling is certainly going to be real for believers, as is the structure that religious observance affords them.
Originally posted by @fmf Ragwort posted:[b]"What if God gave humanity the notion of eternity to enable us to provide a societal narrative beyond our individual lifetime? Such a narrative might better help us to avoid conflict with our neighbours and environment in the here and now to give our species better chances to reach the next millenia. I might consider myself a theist but ...[text shortened]... eated-but-mortal reality, as in [2] above, is discounted (by religionists) as being implausible?
Popularity increases with the following:
1) Greater the gain
2) Lower the cost for said gain
3) Believability
Irrationally for many believability increases the greater the gain and the lower the cost.
In short: [1] Why is there this link drawn, over and over again, by all manner of theist belief systems, between the existence of a creator god and the notion of life after death? [2] What's the matter with idea of a creator god creating beings with a finite opportunity to experience life?
Is it just the human condition that results in this created-therefore-immorta ...[text shortened]... eated-but-mortal reality, as in [2] above, is discounted (by religionists) as being implausible?[/b]
1. I have seen it argued that a society that can promise a life after death may do better against one that doesn't and therefore whose subjects may be more risk averse.
On the face of it this seems reasonable
2. Personally I can see nothing the matter with concept.
In the end it comes down to what Theists mean by the word God and whether they think what they tie their definition to is 1] Capable of or responsible for creation 2] Active in the world in that fashion i.e. planting the notion of life after death for societal reasons.
There is a term I have come across "the idolatry of words" which is the idea that when religious stories from an oral tradition become enshrined in the written word they freeze that society's understanding of "how things are and what is important" at that point in time. The word then becomes "scripture" and held up as an idol. This can stifle growth and allow societal groups to maintain increasingly absurd positions in the face of current understandings of reality.
I think we have seen examples in the Leviticus and Eternal suffering 🙄 (how apt) thread.
The reason all mankind regardless of the religion want eternal life is:
(Ecclesiastes 3:11) He has made everything beautiful in its time. He has even put eternity in their heart; yet mankind will never find out the work that the true God has made from start to finish.
The reason we don't have it is:
(Genesis 2:16, 17) Jehovah God also gave this command to the man: “From every tree of the garden you may eat to satisfaction. 17 But as for the tree of the knowledge of good and bad, you must not eat from it, for in the day you eat from it you will certainly die.”
But, there is hope:
(Acts 24:15) And I have hope toward God, which hope these men also look forward to, that there is going to be a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous.
There are soon to be changes that will allow for everlasting life:
(Psalm 37:10, 11) Just a little while longer, and the wicked will be no more; You will look at where they were, And they will not be there. 11 But the meek will possess the earth, And they will find exquisite delight in the abundance of peace.
(Psalm 37:29) The righteous will possess the earth, And they will live forever on it.
We have a wonderful hope for the future if we put our faith in God and His Son Christ Jesus:
(John 3:16) “For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, so that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.
Originally posted by @roigam The reason all mankind regardless of the religion want eternal life is: [some Bible quotes]
I am not sure you can claim to be explaining the reason why all mankind wants eternal life "regardless of the religion" ... and then seek to explain this by citing your religion. What about the "regardless of the religion" bit? In what way do you think Acts 24:15 or John 3:16 explains the desire for eternal life catered to or created by non-Christian religions?
Because God created all things through His Son Christ Jesus and all mankind
has that desire to live in their hearts.
Think of this, unless there are extreme circumstances, does anyone want to die?
Even people who believe in God do not want to die.
God knows He created us with that desire to live and He wants us to live too.
(see 2 Peter 3:9)
He created us to live, not to die at all.
Since we blew it, because of His loyal love, He has provided a ransom to buy us back
the chance to live forever.
Originally posted by @fmf Well, whether the feeling of purpose is invested in something real or unreal is a matter of religious conviction/faith ~ but the feeling is certainly going to be real for believers, as is the structure that religious observance affords them.
What if. Science as we understand it is primitive. Powerful and informative but limited, and there are deeper understandings.
I've said like forever that rocket science is easy.
Originally posted by @roigam Think of this, unless there are extreme circumstances, does anyone want to die?
Even people who believe in God do not want to die.
I think you are rather proving the point that 'not wanting to die' is the probable cause of beliefs that reassure people that they are going to have some form of life everlasting.
Not wanting to die does not mean that we don't. You seem to have offered evidence for the 'it's the human condition' answer rather than 'we are in fact immortal' answer.
Originally posted by @roigam God knows He created us with that desire to live and He wants us to live too.
So do adherents of Hinduism, Buddhism, Jainism, Sikhism, Zoroastrianism, Islam, Judaism, and the Bahá'í Faith all have an afterlife to look forward to on account of their desire to live on after death and on account of how their religions - like yours - are telling them that it's possible?
We are not immortal.
But, we are created to want to live forever.
That life will always depend on our Creator's continued support.
It also calls for obedience on our part,
That's where our forefather Adam failed, He disobeyed and died.
So you believe that the “little flock” of 144,000 who go to "Heaven" all die eventually? And that the “great crowd” that will reside on Earth will not live forever either?
14 Jan '18 03:22
The Ragwort Questions
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