1. Maryland
    Joined
    10 Jun '05
    Moves
    110629
    18 Feb '12 21:58
    Christians say Jesus died for believers sins. Yet Jesus was resurrected (according to Christians) so if that is true and Jesus is really still alive, then he really did not die for believers sins.
  2. Houston, Texas
    Joined
    28 Sep '10
    Moves
    14347
    18 Feb '12 22:062 edits
    Originally posted by 667joe
    Christians say Jesus died for believers sins. Yet Jesus was resurrected (according to Christians) so if that is true and Jesus is really still alive, then he really did not die for believers sins.
    Never thought about that paradox, but I guess technically he did die.

    Yet, I guess his death might have meant more if resurrection wasn't an option for him. But maybe in making the decision to be the martyr and die, he didn't know he could or would be resurrected, and thus when he died he thought it was a big sacrifice and not that he was going to come back to life.
  3. Standard memberRJHinds
    The Near Genius
    Fort Gordon
    Joined
    24 Jan '11
    Moves
    12695
    18 Feb '12 22:26
    Originally posted by moon1969
    Never thought about that paradox, but I guess techically he did die.

    Yet, I guess his death might have meant more if resurrection wasn't an option for him. But maybe in making the decision to be the martyr and die, he didn't know he could or would be resurrected, and thus when he died he thought it was a big sacrifice and not that he was going to come back to life.
    The resurrection was to prove that Jesus was who He said He was and had
    the power to lay down His life and to take it back again. The resurrection
    was necessaey to give us faith that He could also raise believers like He
    said He would do. Because of the resurrection, we believers look for Him to
    come again like He said He would. The resurrection is the most important
    doctrine for the faithful believers for as Paul said, "Our faith is in vain if He
    has not risen."
  4. Standard memberkaroly aczel
    the Devil himself
    Brisbane,QLD
    Joined
    11 Apr '09
    Moves
    91666
    18 Feb '12 22:38
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    The resurrection was to prove that Jesus was who He said He was and had
    the power to lay down His life and to take it back again. The resurrection
    was necessaey to give us faith that He could also raise believers like He
    said He would do. Because of the resurrection, we believers look for Him to
    come again like He said He would. The resurrection is th ...[text shortened]... rine for the faithful believers for as Paul said, "Our faith is in vain if He
    has not risen."
    Which raises another paradox , which is: which believers will he come back to see and which will have already kicked the bucket by the time he shows up again?
  5. Donationrwingett
    Ming the Merciless
    Royal Oak, MI
    Joined
    09 Sep '01
    Moves
    26187
    18 Feb '12 22:40
    Originally posted by 667joe
    Christians say Jesus died for believers sins. Yet Jesus was resurrected (according to Christians) so if that is true and Jesus is really still alive, then he really did not die for believers sins.
    How can you be resurrected if you didn't die? He did die (at least according to the story), but didn't stay dead. He was dead for three days.

    Of course there were some Christians, like the Gnostics, who believe that Jesus didn't really die. They believe that his death was only an illusion.
  6. Standard memberRJHinds
    The Near Genius
    Fort Gordon
    Joined
    24 Jan '11
    Moves
    12695
    18 Feb '12 22:54
    Originally posted by karoly aczel
    Which raises another paradox , which is: which believers will he come back to see and which will have already kicked the bucket by the time he shows up again?
    Christ will be coming back for all believers even if I have "kicked the bucket".
    The Holy Bible says at that time the dead in Christ will be raised and changed
    first.
  7. Standard memberRJHinds
    The Near Genius
    Fort Gordon
    Joined
    24 Jan '11
    Moves
    12695
    18 Feb '12 22:58
    Originally posted by rwingett
    How can you be resurrected if you didn't die? He did die (at least according to the story), but didn't stay dead. He was dead for three days.

    Of course there were some Christians, like the Gnostics, who believe that Jesus didn't really die. They believe that his death was only an illusion.
    The Gnostics have been declared heretics by the Church because scripture
    clearly proves them wrong.
  8. Standard memberkaroly aczel
    the Devil himself
    Brisbane,QLD
    Joined
    11 Apr '09
    Moves
    91666
    18 Feb '12 22:59
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    Christ will be coming back for all believers even if I have "kicked the bucket".
    The Holy Bible says at that time the dead in Christ will be raised and changed
    first.
    So ... keep an eye on the cemetaries as a sign that Christ is just about to return? If you see some people coming back out of their graves , this is sure to mean that JC is a coming back very soon, ya?
  9. Houston, Texas
    Joined
    28 Sep '10
    Moves
    14347
    18 Feb '12 23:27
    Originally posted by rwingett
    How can you be resurrected if you didn't die? He did die (at least according to the story), but didn't stay dead. He was dead for three days.

    Of course there were some Christians, like the Gnostics, who believe that Jesus didn't really die. They believe that his death was only an illusion.
    Sometimes I wish the gnostics had won the power struggle with the orthodox christians back then. But the orthodox christians were just too ruthless, coniving, and manipulative.
  10. Standard memberRJHinds
    The Near Genius
    Fort Gordon
    Joined
    24 Jan '11
    Moves
    12695
    18 Feb '12 23:30
    Originally posted by moon1969
    Sometimes I wish the gnostics had won the power struggle with the orthodox christians back then. But the orthodox christians were just too ruthless, coniving, and manipulative.
    The also had the written scripture on their side. 😏
  11. Joined
    10 Jun '11
    Moves
    3829
    19 Feb '12 00:27
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    The Gnostics have been declared heretics by the Church because scripture
    clearly proves them wrong.
    no it doesn't. there are plenty of other scriptures. just because the roman church rejected them doesn't mean they don't exist.
  12. Joined
    10 Jun '11
    Moves
    3829
    19 Feb '12 00:27
    Originally posted by moon1969
    Sometimes I wish the gnostics had won the power struggle with the orthodox christians back then. But the orthodox christians were just too ruthless, coniving, and manipulative.
    they had the power of rome behind them.
  13. Donationrwingett
    Ming the Merciless
    Royal Oak, MI
    Joined
    09 Sep '01
    Moves
    26187
    19 Feb '12 01:13
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    The also had the written scripture on their side. 😏
    They're the ones who wrote the scripture.
  14. Account suspended
    Joined
    26 Aug '07
    Moves
    38239
    19 Feb '12 01:46
    Originally posted by rwingett
    How can you be resurrected if you didn't die? He did die (at least according to the story), but didn't stay dead. He was dead for three days.

    Of course there were some Christians, like the Gnostics, who believe that Jesus didn't really die. They believe that his death was only an illusion.
    Muslims also believe that Christ did not die, they say it would not have been a miracle
    if he did, of course this completely negates the value of the propitiatory sacrifice and
    thus they have missed the point entirely.
  15. Standard memberRJHinds
    The Near Genius
    Fort Gordon
    Joined
    24 Jan '11
    Moves
    12695
    19 Feb '12 01:56
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    Muslims also believe that Christ did not die, they say it would not have been a miracle
    if he did, of course this completely negates the value of the propitiatory sacrifice and
    thus they have missed the point entirely.
    There are few that understand the point.
Back to Top