The "Space Alien" thing

Originally posted by @sonship
You need to convince yourself that Hitler's Nazism is the same as God expressed.

I need to do no such thing. The torture of billions and billions of non-believers for being non-believers for eternity is not comparable to what the Nazis did to the Jews for being Jews.

In terms of scale and sheer moral depravity, there is no comparison as notions, ideologies and endorsed/actual actions go.

The torture and suffering of the Jews ended in the gas chambers. It was over relatively quickly. Unless, of course, you believe your god figure has been torturing all those gassed Jews for being non-believers/non-Christians ever since they died [and will do forever more].

Come to think of it, you probably do believe that. Oh well.

"Perfect morality" is how you referred to it, I remember.

Nevertheless, you are sidestepping the question. What is your definition of "glorify"?

Originally posted by @sonship
That the unbelief thing is both exposed and terminated eternally glorifies God.

What is the definition of the word "glorifies" in the sense you have used it in the sentence above?

Originally posted by @sonship
I spend more time contemplating what God did that we might be saved from the torment of being forever joined with Satan.

At the moment you are spending an unbelievable amount of time dancing around trying to avoid explaining what the definition of the word "glorifies", as you've used it, is.

Originally posted by @sonship
God defeating Satan and his followers is not the Nazis gassing the Jews. [/b]

Correct. They are two separate and distinct instances of stupendously grotesque revenge being visited upon human beings by a powerful entity.

When you imagine billions and billions of people being tortured [for their lack of belief] in some kind of magical furnace, forever and ever, watched over by Jesus and some angels - when you try to picture all this in your mind's eye - do you think to yourself, boy oh boy, how glorious my god is?

Originally posted by @sonship
What kind of maturity do you think you demonstrate with the lack a good argument that Jesus never spoke such things pertaining to eternal punishment ?

If you turn out to be wrong, would you rather join the judged ones and have not part in God's "unrighteous" kingdom ? Will you feel forced to stay where you wish not to be - under the reign of a God who unjustly punishes ?

That's two questions, better than 12 in one post I suppose.

Pick one.

Originally posted by sonship
Let me be clear, any reference I made rightly or wrongly to "other worlds" is not meant to mean some Star Trek or Star Wars kind of superior life forms.

Second bump for you sonship, as you "work backwards through the posts"...

I'm not going to let you slip this one in under radar sonship.

No one has ever, not once mentioned Science fiction, it is you trying bring the counter argument against you into mockery. The argument against you is I believe quite serious. It's about error, gross error, it's about plagiarism and it's about your vainity in not being able to apologise for calling me a liar for initially claiming you came out with all this nonsense.

So, what kind of beings are "those on other worlds" who are witnessing the eternal torture of billions as a warning to them?

You said it, denied you'd said it, called me a liar for claiming you did and then huffed off for a couple of weeks when I went and found it. I think you should quit flapping around and either admit you were completely and utterly wrong or explain it.

Originally posted by @karoly-aczel
Strange beliefs?

Why dont you say he's on drugs like you do to me ?

Because he isn't.

Originally posted by @sonship
This is the vindication of His holiness and righteousness...

This kind of negative glory...

The vanquishing of the unbeliever thing works to God's eventual repute and honor...

Good grief. "Negative glory" what on earth is that!!?

Do you know why we disagree so much sonship...it's because despite calling ourselves Christians, we have completely different gods.

You worship a god who gets its glory from designIng, predestining and executing the horrendous eternal torture of billions of people. Yes, predestining their suffering. Your God is a monster.

Originally posted by @sonship
God defeating Satan and his followers is not the Nazis gassing the Jews.

No it isnt, your religious ideology is infinitely worse than the Nazis, worse than any terrororism, worse than any religious executions.

There is a video on the internet (which I will not watch) of a Jordanian pilot being burned alive in a cage by an ISIS soldier. You should find this video, I'll get it for you if you like, and you can watch it. You will see the horror of a few minutes of a person's life as the flames engulf him in unimaginable agony. He lived only a few short minutes.

What you think is the glory of your God is for billions of people to suffer that agony for eternity. Being supernaturally kept alive from minute to minute forever by your version of the loving Jesus, while he spectates the horror.

Don't you ever stop to think about what it is you believe?

Originally posted by @sonship
The controversial paragraph is not a translation of a Bible verse.
It is free English prose, commentary, partly from one writer Robert Govette and partly from me.

So you're starting off barking up the wrong tree altogether.

Commentary on what?

Originally posted by @divegeester
No it isnt, your religious ideology is infinitely worse than the Nazis, worse than any terrororism, worse than any religious executions.

There is a video on the internet (which I will not watch) of a Jordanian pilot being burned alive in a cage by an ISIS soldier. You should find this video, I'll get it for you if you like, and you can watch it. You ...[text shortened]... s, while he spectates the horror.

Don't you ever stop to think about what it is you believe?

Don't you ever stop to think about what it is you believe?

Stopping to think what I believe is not stopping to think of your take on everything.
Stopping to think what I believe is not stopping to decide to disbelieve what the word of Jesus Christ was.

I don't stop to think what I believe with a pair of scissors to cut verses out of the New Testament. Extracting words out of the text as if they are not there is not my way to stop and consider.

if the word of God tells me that if anyone's name who was not written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire, "stopping to thin" what I believe comes short of shutting my eyes and saying "It is not there, It is not there."

Originally posted by @sonship
Did you ever consider that you so badly need the assistance of an Atheist to help you interpret Scripture ? Do you consider the irony of your taking refuge behind the arguments of an Atheist it seek the Bible's message clearly ?

Is it, in your view, ironic that you are attempting this clumsy dodge/deflection vis a vis what divegeester is putting to you, when you yourself are hiding behind some demented screed by Robert Govette which you plagiarized and which contains words you refuse to define?

Give it up FMF. You abandoned your weak faith.

Sonship provides a valuable voice here, and you are in NO position to challenge it.

You discarded God, you discarded Jesus.

Originally posted by @chaney3
Give it up FMF. You abandoned your weak faith.

Sonship provides a valuable voice here, and you are in NO position to challenge it.

You discarded God, you discarded Jesus.

sonship reckons the agony of billions of non-Christians being tortured in flames forever "glorifies" his god figure. I am asking him to define the words "glory" and "glorify" in this context, as he uses them. He should embrace the opportunity to advertise the true nature of this supernatural being he believes in, however he is bottling out, utterly and completely. It's interesting.

Originally posted by @divegeester
Good grief. "Negative glory" what on earth is that!!?

Do you know why we disagree so much sonship...it's because despite calling ourselves Christians, we have completely different gods.

You worship a god who gets its glory from designIng, predestining and executing the horrendous eternal torture of billions of people. Yes, predestining their suffering. Your God is a monster.

"Negative glory" is not a good of a phrase.

But the fact remains that in judgment God was glorified. It the final crushing of Antichrist and his kingdom, the vision of the glory of God is striking.

"And one of the four living creatures gave to the seven angels seven golden bowls full of the fury of God, who lives forever and ever.

And the temple was filled with smoke from the glory of God and from His power, and no one could enter into the temple until the seven plagues of the seven angels were finished." (Rev. 15:7,8)

That this vision may contain symbolism is not disputed.
Still the word picture is of God's righteous and glorious crushing of His enemies. And that after much longsuffering and patient endurance. Enough is enough.

That no one could enter into the temple until this righteous fury is accomplished
suggests that intercession for those judged at this point is not righteous and interferes with His right and glorious crushing of Antichrist.

" ... And no one could enter into the temple until the seven plagues of the seven angels were finished."

The time to petition, plead, ask mercy on behalf, and pray for the un-reconciled is now.
Today we may still enter into God's presence and make intercession for sinners.

The word picture of Revelation 15:7,8 is to me an indication that for God to BE God there will come a point where His judgment must fall.