the time before time

Originally posted by stellspalfie
god is love. so god loved before man before man was created. god has always been aware of everything so has always loved those things, time is meaningless and has no context in gods love.

i was going somewhere else, but this constant use of the world 'love' is interesting.
does the bible define what love is? i feel various forms of love and they are all very different.

God is spirit, so love is a spiritual quality. It is not physical, so you can't really touch it, but you can experience it. I believe it is something like your emotions. But that is just me, and you know how I am.

Originally posted by RJHinds
God is spirit, so love is a spiritual quality. It is not physical, so you can't really touch it, but you can experience it. I believe it is something like your emotions. But that is just me, and you know how I am.

you are replacing the undefined word 'love' with the undefined word 'spirit'. can you define them?

Originally posted by stellspalfie
i know you guys dont like to question god......but, what did he do before the whole earth,bible,destruction,jesus,love thing? did he experience love before he thought of us.........if not, did we create love?

- bored

- invented singing, then hummed those songs to himself, then those songs stuck in his head so he spent a huge chunk of non-time trying to forget them.

- invented solitaire, and played every combination of cards possible

- made the first tv ever, then destroyed it because nothing was on.

- stared at nothingness for a lot of time and not at all

- had an imaginary friend name Pookie, had a huge fight with him, now nobody knows about pookie. pookie was an ashole

Wolfgang:

The same god that created William Shakespeare wrote that pile of nonsense!

Do you not think an omnipotent god would be a better wordsmith?

Oh, I don't know about that bit of juvenile ignorance on your part.

The book of Job has been discribed as the greatest poetry ever written.

And the Gospel of Luke has also be discribed as the most beautiful book ever written. You may remember a motion picture called The Greatest Story Ever Told ?

You also could not produce 11 chapters of any other ancient or modern writing as Genesis which in the same number of words disclosed this many interesting matters:


1.) The origin of space and time and matter.
2.) The origin of plants and animals.
3.) The origin of the seven day week.
4.) The basic nature of mankind.
5.) The purpose of man's creation.
6.) The names of the first man and woman.
7.) The origin of the institution of marriage.
8.) The origin of sin and death.
9.) The history of the first family.
10.) The history of the first murder.
11.) The origin of nomadic life.
12.) The name of the first city built by man.
13.) The origin of polygamy.
14.) The origin of musical performance.
15.) The origin of metal industry.
16) The origin of agriculture
17.) The first notable history of people twisting God's words.
18.) The historic backround of mythic super heroes and demigods.
19.) The first religion.
20.) The history of one early world wide language.
21.) The origin of the spread of humans across the globe.


These matters are all covered in the wordsmithing of the first 10 or 11 chapters of the book of Genesis.

Produce another writing that takes as few words to touch on so many important points of interest about man and his world.

And I don't mean a collection of different writings touching on them.
I mean as many words in one document, such as Genesis, which conveys so many important matters.

If you follow up with nothing, we'll know you're busy choking on your own asinine juvenile comment on poor word smithing in the Bible.

Not difficult? Are you really serious? I can see beyond doubt that you actually know very little about this book then.
Perhaps you should read the whole thing and then give me your opinion afterwards.

Originally posted by sonship
Wolfgang:

The same god that created William Shakespeare wrote that pile of nonsense!

Do you not think an omnipotent god would be a better wordsmith?

Oh, I don't know about that bit of juvenile ignorance on your part.

The book of [b]Job has been discribed as the greatest poetry ever written.

And the Gospel of Luke[ ...[text shortened]... u're busy choking on your own asinine juvenile comment on poor word smithing in the Bible.

Firstly I am not discussing content only quality of the prose.

You obviously think the content has a value while I think it worthless, we
cannot move forward from that!

Regarding quality you give Job and Luke, I have read both and cannot
remember being particularly impressed - that is not to say there are not
some lovely passages in the bible. But we are talking about an all powerful
god who surely should be able to produce his best work all the time

If you truly want to justify your position of the bible being god's word and
god being omnipotent, then you must defend the worst passages of the bible.

Can you do that?

Originally posted by galveston75
Not difficult? Are you really serious? I can see beyond doubt that you actually know very little about this book then.
Perhaps you should read the whole thing and then give me your opinion afterwards.

I speed read the OT and have read all the gospels. Got bored after that.
Does it get better?

Originally posted by wolfgang59
I speed read the OT and have read all the gospels. Got bored after that.
Does it get better?

Revelation is fun in a mad acid trip kind of way.

Originally posted by stellspalfie
you are replacing the undefined word 'love' with the undefined word 'spirit'. can you define them?

These can not be defined to the natural man for he receives not the things of the Spirit.

The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit.

(1 Corithians 2:14 NIV)

Originally posted by Kepler
Revelation is fun in a mad acid trip kind of way.

Revelation was exactly what corporate Christianity needed.

Firstly I am not discussing content only quality of the prose.

I am talking about wordsmithing - both content and quality of prose too. And I don't think William Shakespeare would have agreed with your comment.

You obviously think the content has a value while I think it worthless, we
cannot move forward from that!

If you think the Bible is "worthless" than you're out of step with 2,000 years of Western Civilization. Both content and quality of the most of the Bible is highly acclaimed by people who know.

Regarding quality you give Job and Luke, I have read both and cannot
remember being particularly impressed -

Maybe you did get something. But maybe you quickly made a decision to reject anything you received.

In the book of Luke Jesus discribed FOUR kinds of hearts comparing them to four kinds of soil. The first analogy represented those who hear the word of God and an enemy snatches the living benefit from their heart like birds pecking up seeds sown along the roadway.

"The sower went out to sow his seed. And as he sowed, some seed fell beside the way, and it was trampled underfoot, and the birds of heaven devoured it." (Luke 8:4,5)

Then Jesus gave His explanation.

"Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God. And those beside the way are those who heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they would not believe and be saved." (8:11,12)

Perhaps the evil spirit simply stole what was sown into your heart immediately and you received nothing as spiritual enlightenment. You may still have need to be saved.

You know, "by the way" may indicate too much worldly traffic tramping up and down. Heavy traffic makes the ground hardened for seed to take root.

Perhaps you love for this present world has simply hardened your heart like the soil by the well worn pathway. The hardness of the world loving heart makes it easy for the Devil to snatch away any seeds of God's truth from your heart.

Maybe that is why you have a sense of having gotten no benefit. Or you could have just rejected anything that kind of stroke your fur the wrong direction, like you're so perfect that you don't even need the Son of God to say anything to you.

I come to the Bible hungry to receive something from God.
I come with a thirst to receive God Himself.
And I come with a willingness to allow God's Spirit to change me should I need changing.

Some people are just not spiritually hungry enough yet. Again from Luke 1:53

"The hungry He has filled with good things, and the rich He has sent away empty."

People who come to the word of God like they are so rich in themselves and so perfect, that they have no need of anything, and no need especially of God, often go away from the word empty.

Try spending a moment before you read confessing that you are hungry and thirsting for righteousness.

"Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be satisfied." (Matt.5:6)

that is not to say there are not
some lovely passages in the bible. But we are talking about an all powerful
god who surely should be able to produce his best work all the time

The Bible has been "powerful" enough to be the source of wisdom and direction for about two millennia, especially in the western world.

Of course now in the Far East as well millions of Christians are gleaning the comfort and encouragement and meaning for their lives from the Bible.
Millions in China who could not be snuffed out by Communism, though meeting underground, are powerfully preserved through the Chinese translation of the Holy Bible.

If you truly want to justify your position of the bible being god's word and
god being omnipotent, then you must defend the worst passages of the bible.

Can you do that?

LOL. I suspect that any book which God communicated to man would contain SOME difficult portions.

I think it is foolish to assume that I would have absolutely no problem with ANY line from a book authored by God. My daily living suggests I will have some problems with His word sometimes.

I do not discard the revelation of God to man because some portions of it are problematic. And I do not assume nothing whatsoever writtin in a book of God would ever be found difficult for me to understand.

I continue to feast on its riches and grow to spiritual maturity. Something I do not understand at a younger stage of spiritual growth will probably be better understood at more mature level of spiritual growth.

Remember, God has to speak to ALL the people. And ALL the people are at various levels of spiritual maturity. So there is milk in the word of God. And there is meat in the word of God. And there is also some hard "bones" in the word of God.

I don't discard the whole Bible because of some difficult passage here or there.

You have completely lost the point of my original criticism.

I speed read the OT and have read all the gospels. Got bored after that.
Does it get better?

You are not exercising your spirit.

You are not using your spiritual organ and should slow down and pray over parts of what you read.

Then you would be exercising your spiritual muscle and just swiftly dashing through it assuming your speedy mind is all you need.

Watchman Nee was a very fast speed reader with something of a photographic memory to recall information. Yet his expositions of the Bible are extrememly rich as if he went over it with a electron microscope.

He exercised his spiritual organ and prayerfully read the word of God for enlightenment.

Originally posted by wolfgang59
You have completely lost the point of my original criticism.

I don't think William Shakespeare would have agreed with your criticism of poor wordsmithing of the Bible.

Moving on.

Originally posted by sonship
You are not using your spiritual organ and should slow down and pray over parts of what you read.

I am used to you weirdoes making up words and definitions ... now you are
making up body parts! "Spiritual organ" ! What nonsense.

As for praying while I read ... lol ... I do not talk to imaginery creatures!!!!