the time before time

Originally posted by wolfgang59
I am used to you weirdoes making up words and definitions ... now you are
making up body parts! "Spiritual organ" ! What nonsense.

As for praying while I read ... lol ... I do not talk to imaginery creatures!!!!

Wolfgang,

To get the color red, you have to use your eyes.
You cannot hear the color red or the color blue.
The ear is not the proper organ to substantiate what red or blue is.
The proper organ is your eyes.

To get the taste of a apple you cannot put it into your ear to hear the taste. The ear is the wrong organ. But the tongue is the proper organ to taste food.

Now these are indeed physical organs. But we can borrow the analogy when it comes to spiritual realities.

You cannot touch God directly with your mind.
But you have a facility that can be exercised to substantiate God and touch God. That "organ" for lack of a better word, is your human spirit. And you exercise you human spirit one way by praying.

Something deeper than you mind has to be stirred up to touch God. And that is not a completely passive process. You can cooperate and break free from total passivity to exercise your "God touching, God tasting, God substantiating organ."


The analogy is not perfect. But it is useful.

God is Spirit is a mysterious matter to speak of. But think of Spirit as like radio waves.

If I said 500 years ago "Man, the air is filled with radio waves. Radio waves are everywhere in the air playing all kinds of things like music and speech." People would be puzzled.

I speak of touching God. You are puzzled. More than that, you're skeptical and indignant perhaps. But God as Holy Spirit is something like radio waves.

As in picking up radio waves you have to use a radio antenna. So for God, for God now, you have something like an antenna. You can pick up the "radio waves" of the Holy Spirit by learning to exercise your spiritual "antenna".

This is why I recommended praying over and praying with the words of the Bible. Then you learn to touch God the Spirit directly. Your mind is of course tremendously useful otherwise God would not have created you with a mind. But your mind is needed to interpret what it does not directly touch. The direct touch of God is in a deeper part of you, in your "antenna" for the spiritual "radio waves." You have to use your spirit.

You may begin by asking God to help you to use your spirit. "Lord God, help me to learn my spirit and to use my spirit to touch You Lord."

Analogies are pointless.

Originally posted by wolfgang59
Analogies are pointless.

No, analogies can be helpful if you are open minded.

Your human spirit is dormant, comatose. Your praying "organ" which can touch Jesus and taste God is out of use.

Sometime you may stumble upon your spirit. But you don't know how you got there. Maybe one time you seemed to come close to God. Maybe not.

But most people do not discern their spirit. But they DO detect often that something in them is missing.

That sense of something missing or not addressed deep within you is probably the sense of your comatose spirit. Your spirit needs to be regenerated.

"That which is born of the Spirit is spirit."

You have a human spirit. It is deeper than your soul and deeper than your mind. Your human spirit can touch God. Your human spirit can be enlivened within you.

Often the sense of a vacuum or hollow space within you even when you think you should be perfectly happy, is the sense of your spirit not being alive.

In this case you are like a being made for a three dimensional world which is only functioning on two dimensions. Often you sense the missing dimension.

Originally posted by sonship
No, analogies can be helpful if you are open minded.

Your human spirit is dormant, comatose. Your praying "organ" which can touch Jesus and taste God is out of use.

Sometime you may stumble upon your spirit. But you don't know how you got there. Maybe one time you seemed to come close to God. Maybe not.

But most people do not discern their s ...[text shortened]... l world which is only functioning on two dimensions. Often you sense the missing dimension.

I have no doubt of your sincerity but believe me when
I say - with equal sincerity - that you are deluded and
wasting your life believing in the supernatural.

If you have any evidence of anything you have said I will
gladly look at it, but until then it just remains an idea in
your head.

What we can discuss - as I originally proposed - is an
examination of the literary merits of the bible. Is it really
the work of an omnipotent being?

Originally posted by wolfgang59
I have no doubt of your sincerity but believe me when
I say - with equal sincerity - that you are deluded and
wasting your life believing in the supernatural.

If you have any evidence of anything you have said I will
gladly look at it, but until then it just remains an idea in
your head.

What we can discuss - as I originally proposed - is an
examination of the literary merits of the bible. Is it really
the work of an omnipotent being?

We believe God is more powerful than any other being or force in nature. However, that might not fit your definition of an omnipotent being.

Originally posted by RJHinds
We believe God is more powerful than any other being or force in nature. However, that might not fit your definition of an omnipotent being.

1. It was stated that the bible is god's word.
2. We take it as 'read' that your god is omnipotent.
3. I asked why the bible is so badly written.

?

Originally posted by wolfgang59
1. It was stated that the bible is god's word.
2. We take it as 'read' that your god is omnipotent.
3. I asked why the bible is so badly written.

?

I asked why the bible is so badly written? -- wolfgang

How do you know it is badly written?
Can you read and write Hebrew or Greek? -- RJHinds

Originally posted by wolfgang59
I have no doubt of your sincerity but believe me when
I say - with equal sincerity - that you are deluded and
wasting your life believing in the supernatural.

If you have any evidence of anything you have said I will
gladly look at it, but until then it just remains an idea in
your head.

What we can discuss - as I originally proposed - is an
examination of the literary merits of the bible. Is it really
the work of an omnipotent being?

I have no doubt of your sincerity but believe me when
I say - with equal sincerity - that you are deluded and
wasting your life believing in the supernatural.

Why am I wasting my life to love Jesus Christ ?

I am rather entrusting my life in the safest and best place in the whole universe. That is in the care of the Savior Who as the Perfect Man laid down His life for me and rose again from the dead.

This is absolutely the best possible care into which I could place my life.
If you offer me something more of value and preciousness than the Son of God than what is it ?

If you have any evidence of anything you have said I will
gladly look at it, but until then it just remains an idea in
your head.

I already presented you with some evidence. You know that something is missing in your life. Don't even try to save face in front of your unbelieving buddies here. You yourself know that are strangly incomplete.

You do not know WHAT it is that is missing. But I told you that your innermost spiritual being, your human spirit is in a comatose and damaged state of deadenness.

"You must be born again." Your human spirit needs to be made alive with a touch from Jesus Christ. This is giving [ZOE] or giving the divine life of God to your innermost being.

"the last Adam became a life giving Spirit" (1 Cor. 15:45)

Your innermost being needs to be givine the zoe divine life of the living Person of Christ - the last Adam.

What we can discuss - as I originally proposed - is an
examination of the literary merits of the bible. Is it really
the work of an omnipotent being?

You keep mentioning "omnipotent being". There is someting nearly
"omnipotent" as anything in the universe. That is your own free will to choose or reject salvation.

You see you may keep talking about "omnipotent" God. But in creating you with a free deciding will to choose God or reject God, God has necessarily relinquished some of the divine All Power up for your sake. Feel the power then of your own "omnipotent" free will.

Your free decision to receive the Lord Jesus or reject the Lord Jesus is the greatest power that even God will not violate. He is willing on His side to grant you complete forgiveness and redemption in Christ. He is quite willing on His side. He is quite faithful on His side to follow through.

But you yourself have this awesome power of your on free choice to determine your own destiny - to be saved or to be lost forever.

So when you use "omnipotent" again I want you to consider that God has necessarily relinquished some power in that He will not force you to receive salvation in Jesus Christ. Within you is the free power to say "No" to God.

I am thankful that I opened my heart and said yes. And the only wasted time is time not spent enjoying the resurrected and available Christ.

Each microsecond spent in communion with Jesus Christ is the best possible use of human time I could ever imagine.

Good speaking with you.
www.localchurches.org

Originally posted by wolfgang59
I speed read the OT and have read all the gospels. Got bored after that.
Does it get better?

Lol. Does it get better you ask?

Not if you don't want it to be. What else can I say?

But you would have to understand a couple things in oder for it to not be "bored".
First the whole Bible is really on one subject as dificult as that seems to be.
And that is God's solution to bring back the planet and all on it back to his original gift of not only a beautiful planet but to once again let us live as he originally designed us too and this is to be done within his timetable.
Satan challenged God right to rule us and this book is explaining the time and steps of how this precess happened and how it is being corrected.
Not only is the Bible full of incredable historical facts but it is a guide to know who God is and what he is doing for us even as we speak today.
This book is our only way to survive this satan led world and to once again have a real and truthful relationship with him.
So....one should slow down and read the bible and more importantly let yourself be taught as Jesus did teach many as well as his followers being teachers too.
Not many can sit down and read a book of higher learning without being taught by a teacher.

Originally posted by galveston75
Lol. Does it get better you ask?

Not if you don't want it to be. What else can I say?

But you would have to understand a couple things in oder for it to not be "bored".
First the whole Bible is really on one subject as dificult as that seems to be.
And that is God's solution to bring back the planet and all on it back to his original gift of ...[text shortened]... Not many can sit down and read a book of higher learning without being taught by a teacher.

I agree and the higher teacher is the Holy Spirit. Speed reading may be okay to get a quick overview. However, to gain an understanding of the spiritual meaning within the words of the Holy Bible one must slowly eat the words and give much time for digesting and the imparting of wisdom from the Holy Spirit, if you get my drift.

Originally posted by galveston75
So his words do not meet with your approval I see. Lets see you write a book such as the Bible...

Look at the Quran and do you see the influence of your god there? That is the same old tired argument about the pyramids, that mere men could not possibly have had the intelligence to do it himself, therefore aliens exist. Men are totally creative enough to come up with any kind of religious nonsense and there are thousands of religious books with just as much wisdom as your bible. Wisdom does not mean godliness. It means creative and smart people wrote the words down without needing a single word from any god.

There are too many different so-called religious texts for them to have come from a god, where one text calls for the death of another religion, each one claiming to be THE true religion. You can see how well that worked out.

Originally posted by RJHinds
I asked why the bible is so badly written? -- wolfgang

How do you know it is badly written?
Can you read and write Hebrew or Greek? -- RJHinds

Great literature translates.
I've just read Sophie's World again and maybe its better in the original
Norwegian but its still great in English (and has done pretty well in the
other 50 languages it's been translated into)

Originally posted by sonship

Why am I wasting my life to love Jesus Christ ?

I am rather entrusting my life in the safest and best place in the whole universe. That is in the care of the Sa ime I could ever imagine.

Good speaking with you.
www.localchurches.org

I feel I should tell you that I have no time for your sermons.

Originally posted by wolfgang59
1. It was stated that the bible is god's word.
2. We take it as 'read' that your god is omnipotent.
3. I asked why the bible is so badly written.

?

"I asked why the bible is so badly written."

Intersting comment but in fact it was written perfectly. It's not a fiction book or travel guide or a how to dummie book.
It's so much better. It speaks of how the universe came into existance as well as animals and humans. We may never know how God did this but from our perspective it was easy for him and is really no mystery like some theories are.
It lets us get to know our God and it expalins why we are in the condition of much sorrow and wickedness and why that has happened to us.
And even better it explains why in our view it has taken so long for him to correct it.
And finally it gives us hope and happiness to know that he will repair it all very soon by signs and prophicies in his book.
I can't think of any book ever written tha tcan even come close to what this book is for humans.

Originally posted by wolfgang59
Great literature translates.
I've just read Sophie's World again and maybe its better in the original
Norwegian but its still great in English (and has done pretty well in the
other 50 languages it's been translated into)

It might be great literature, which is open to debate, but it certainly was not inspired by a god. It was written from page one to page last by men, creative men for sure but men nonetheless.

It was done to start a religion which controlled people, simple as that, attract weak minds that can contribute to the political power of the religion which it succeeded in really well.

But actual spirituality? ZERO. NO human knows jack about spirituality, including me and especially including you. Sorry Wolf, I thought I was talking to RJ.

Been a long day. 8 hour workday plus 4 hour commute.