The Trinity in First Corinthians 3

Originally posted by divegeester

It's a simple question, there is no guile in it, no hidden meaning, no difficult syntax to stumble over. Just an honest enquiry about what you believe sonship.

I believe the answer should be no. I believe in the oneness of God, but I do not believe that a person believing in the trinity doctrine cannot be filled with the spirit of God. Unequivocal.

Your go.

Firstly, I don't read some posters' comments anymore ... period.
So I may have no idea of what someone else, you consider having said something significant, said.

Secondly, you seemed to have gotten something out of your system. Good for you.
I don't think every talk I embark on concerning the triune nature of God HAS to stop in its tracks in order to discuss the assurance of salvation.

If you think every thread about the Trinity will be immediately halted and diverted to talk about assurance of salvation, I won't let that stop me from talking about the Trinity.

I believe the answer should be no. I believe in the oneness of God, but I do not believe that a person believing in the trinity doctrine cannot be filled with the spirit of God. Unequivocal.

I think you meant to write "I do not believe that a person [NOT] believing in the trinity doctrine cannot be filled with the spirit of God. Uniquivocal."

I assume you left out the word "not".

I have nothing particular to add except I too believe in the oneness of God.
God's nature is very mysterious. And the Bible shows that He is one in three and three in one.

If you think you can prove that the Bible does NOT show that, I have left plenty of questions concerning that on the thread on John 16. You can attempt to argue that the answers you propose there do not suggest a Tri-une God.

Originally posted by sonship
[quote] It's a simple question, there is no guile in it, no hidden meaning, no difficult syntax to stumble over. Just an honest enquiry about what you believe sonship.

I believe the answer should be no. I believe in the oneness of God, but I do not believe that a person believing in the trinity doctrine cannot be filled with the spirit of God. Unequivoc ...[text shortened]... ttempt to argue that the [b]answers you propose there do not suggest a Tri-une God.[/b]

If you just answered the question instead of being all furtive and dodging it, then perhaps it would go away... 😉

Originally posted by divegeester
If you just answered the question instead of being all furtive and dodging it, then perhaps it would go away... 😉

I prefer to ignore further need to address it.
I warned you that every thread I start or discuss the Trinity will not be halted to deal with personal assurance of salvation. Get use to it or just stop reading my posts.

Now you may stop reading at this point if you wish. But I have something more to say about the gold, silver, and precious stones being representative of the work of the Trinity in Christians there in Corinth.

The Father's nature alone in man can build up the Father's house.
The Son's work of redemption alone can build up that house.
The transforming work of the Holy Spirit alone can eliminate the plentiful yet worthless things to build God's house.

The work of the Triune God is the work in man to build up God's living temple. The house being built is the temple of God.

" Or do you not know that you are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwells in you?

If anyone destroys the temple of God, God will destroy him; for the temple of God is holy, and such are you." ( 1 Cor. 3:16,17)

I maintain that the building of the church, the temple of God, must be with the work of the Triune God. That may not be the doctrine but the operation of the Triune God. His work of the three is represented by the three substances which alone can endure the fire of Christ's examination.

Mere human goodness and mere human activity devoid of the work of the Father - Son - Holy Spirit will not survive the judgment seat of Christ.

This note is helpful from Witness Lee from the Life Study of First Corinthians
on the burnable substances of wood, grass, and stubble in contrast to the work of the Trinity.

B. Wood

Specifically and practically, wood here refers to the human nature of the Greeks. By nature the Greeks are very philosophical. I believe they even philosophized concerning Christ. Thus, wood refers to their nature, their natural makeup. In the same principle, wood denotes what we are according to our natural makeup. For example, the Chinese have an ethical nature. This is their “wood.” We should not build the church with wood. This means that we should not build it with our nature, with our natural makeup.

C. Grass

We have pointed out that grass signifies the unredeemed man of the flesh. Wood signifies the nature of the Greeks, whereas grass signifies the natural man of the Greeks. To build the church with grass is to build it with what we are in our natural being. For example, the leader of the Brethren assembly I attended in Chefoo was a very slow and steady person. He always walked slowly, carefully, and deliberately. Once in teaching the Bible he said that God always does things slowly. Because of the influence of this leader, almost everyone in that assembly learned to be slow. When they came into the area of the meeting hall, they walked very slowly. Furthermore, all the prayers in the meetings were offered in a very slow way. That entire Brethren assembly was according to the natural being of the leader. This is an illustration of what it means to build the church with grass.

To build with grass is to build with what we are and with what we prefer. Suppose a particular person has a strong preference for speaking in tongues. To seek to promote tongues-speaking is to build with grass. Whenever we build according to what we are in our natural being or according to our natural preference, we build with grass.

D.
Stubble

Stubble signifies the work and living which issue from an earthen source. Stubble is altogether without life. To build with stubble is even worse than building with wood and grass. Jealousy, strife, envy, gossip, and criticism are all aspects of stubble. Philosophical people are usually very critical. The more they think in a philosophical way, the more they criticize others. Such criticism is stubble.

It is very difficult among Christians today to find the proper building materials. Where can you find gold, silver, and precious stones? However, there is an abundance of wood, grass, and stubble. Everywhere we can see the natural makeup, the natural being, and even such things as jealousy, envy, strife, hatred, murmuring, and complaining. In almost any Christian group you can find wood, grass, stubble; that is, you can find the building according to the natural makeup, the natural being, and the characteristics of earthly living. In particular, in 1 Corinthians 3 wood, grass, and stubble refer to the Greek nature, the Greek being, and the evil of the Greek way of living, especially as these things were expressed among the believers in Corinth.

In chapter three Paul charges the saints not to lay anything or anyone other than Christ as the unique foundation. This means that we must not exalt anyone or anything in place of Christ. If we exalt someone or something instead of Christ, we lay another foundation. Paul also charges us to take heed how we build upon Christ as the unique foundation. The Corinthians were not to build with their Greek nature, their Greek self, or their Greek jealousy, strife, and criticism. In other words, they were not to build the church with anything Greek.

http://www.ministrybooks.org/SearchMinBooksDsp.cfm?id=3EB774DFC6

Originally posted by sonship
I prefer to ignore further need to address it.
I warned you that every thread I start or discuss the Trinity will not be halted to deal with personal assurance of salvation. Get use to it or just stop reading my posts.

Now you may stop reading at this point if you wish. But I have something more to say about the [b]gold, silver, and precious stones ...[text shortened]... anything Greek. [/quote]

http://www.ministrybooks.org/SearchMinBooksDsp.cfm?id=3EB774DFC6[/b]

Next time I'll ask Suzianne.

Originally posted by sonship
I prefer to ignore further need to address it.
I warned you that every thread I start or discuss the Trinity will not be halted to deal with personal assurance of salvation. Get use to it or just stop reading my posts.

Now you may stop reading at this point if you wish. But I have something more to say about the [b]gold, silver, and precious stones ...[text shortened]... anything Greek. [/quote]

http://www.ministrybooks.org/SearchMinBooksDsp.cfm?id=3EB774DFC6[/b]

God is gold, silver and precious stones ? 😀 LOL

You and your idol Witness Lee, are idolatrous pagans.

Originally posted by Rajk999
God is gold, silver and precious stones ? 😀 LOL

You and your idol Witness Lee, are idolatrous pagans.

The scheme lf gold, silver, and precious stones being perhaps symbols of the work of the Triune God is not limited to First Corinthians.

This three fold mention of these materials or similar materials is repeated elsewhere in the Bible.

For example both in the beginning of the divine revelation in the book of Genesis and in the end in the book of Revelation we have these reminders. And perhaps they do point to the operation of the Triune God.

Genesis -

" And a river went forth from Eden to water the garden, and from there it divided and became four branches.

The name of the first is Pishon; it is the one that goes around the whole land of Havilah, where there is GOLD. And the GOLD of that land is good; and BDELLIUM and ONYX STONE are there. (Genesis 2:10-12)

Instead of silver connected with the Son we have bdellium which is connected with the Son. It is a resinous substance that is squeezed out of a certain kind of tree. This may point to the Son of God.

Witness Lee, who has been used by God to raise up many hundreds of churches on the five continents writes in the book "The Divine Economy" -

We have already pointed out that bdellium is a pearl produced from the plant life and not from the animal life. The shedding of the blood from the animal life is required for redemption, but with the plant life there is no thought of redemption. In Genesis 1 and 2 sin had not come in yet, and man had not fallen. Thus, there was no need of redemption, but there was still the need of the secretion of the life-juice. Thus, bdellium signifies that the Son of God had to be a tree to be broken to secrete His life-juice to produce bdellium. In the Bible the plant life signifies the producing, multiplying, and propagating life.

Gold pointing to the divine life of the Father.
Bdellium pointing to the secreted life out from the Son of God.
'The precious [b]onyx stone may indicate the transforming work of the Holy Spirit.

This could indicate that even in Genesis in the creation of man, it was on the heart of God to accomplish His eternal purpose through His three-one Being in His economical move.

The similar three-fold material substances pointing to the Trinity is seen in Revelation at the conclusion of the Bible.

The street of the New Jerusalem is gold meaning man walks by the divine nature of the Father.
The gates of the new Jerusalem are twelve pearls corresponding to the poured out bdellium of Genesis. For the Son of God was as an oyster which came to the bottom of the sea of death. and on the cross, we sinners, as an offending particle of sand, wounded this oyster.

And in his wound the oyster pours out a substance around the offending particle much like the resin is poured out of the cut tree. This pearl therefore represents the work the Son of God who pours out His life for and around the offending sinner. This pouring out of the Son of God's life is the very entrance into the eternal city.

And lastly the wall of the New Jerusalem is adorned with twelve manner of precious stones which signify the Holy Spirits transforming work upon the saved human beings.

This is only a very brief word. It is given to show that the three substances:

Gold, silver, precious stones in First Corinthians and
Gold, bdellium, and precious onyx stone in Genesis and
Gold. pearl, and precious stones in Revelation symbolize the same matter:

The Triune God's work to accomplish His eternal purpose in man.

Brother Witness Lee added more helpful ministry on bdellium below:

When the Lord died on the cross, He was broken. A soldier pierced His side with a spear and there came out blood and water (John 19:34). Two things came out of the Lord's side—blood for redemption and water for life secretion. In Genesis 2 there was only the need of the secretion of life. There was no need of the shedding of blood because in Genesis 2 there was no sin. In John 19 from the side of the broken Jesus, blood came out for redemption, dealing with sins (John 1:29; Heb. 9:22) for the purchase of the church (Acts 20:28), and water came out for the secretion of the life-juice, for imparting life, dealing with death (John 12:24; 3:14-15) for the producing of the church (Eph. 5:29-32).

Silver signifies the redeeming Christ with all the virtues of His person and work. Today the Son of God is signified in God's building as the silver. With bdellium there was the thought of life secretion only, but with silver there is the thought of redemption, which includes the shedding of blood and the secretion of life.

In the consummation of the Bible there is neither bdellium nor silver but pearls. Pearls are something produced by the animal life of the oyster. Pearls imply the thought of redemption and the thought of life-secretion to the uttermost. Pearls are produced by the oysters in the waters of death. When the oyster is wounded by a particle of sand, it secretes its life-juice around the sand and makes it a precious pearl. In eternity future, we will still be reminded that the Son of God came into the death waters as the living One, the oyster, and was crucified, being wounded by us to redeem us and to secrete His life over us to make us precious pearls for the building of God's eternal expression.

The tree of life signifies Christ as our life received into us. Then the Spirit as the river of water of life flows within us. The result of this flow is that we are transformed into precious materials. In the spiritual sense, gold, bdellium, and onyx stone all signify transformation. The old creation gets transformed to be the new creation. The Lord wants to transform us from a dust man into a gold man with bdellium and onyx stone. We have to believe that the Lord has added some amount of gold, bdellium or silver, and onyx stone into our being. This is not merely creation, but transformation in resurrection by the Triune God. We need to praise and thank the Lord for the transformation of the Triune God in resurrection. This is God's economy. The tree of life, the river of water, the gold, the bdellium, and onyx stone are all for God's economy. This is to dispense the Triune God into His created man.

http://www.ministrybooks.org/SearchMinBooksDsp.cfm?id=1ED0CF79F9

Originally posted by sonship
The scheme lf gold, silver, and precious stones being perhaps symbols of the work of the Triune God is not limited to [b]First Corinthians.

This three fold mention of these materials or similar materials is repeated elsewhere in the Bible.

For example both in the beginning of the divine revelation in the book of Genesis and in the end ...[text shortened]... /b] and
Gold. pearl, and precious stones in Revelation symbolize the same matter:[/b]

God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit.cannot be likened to physical objects.
Witness Lee is an idiot to make these comparisons, and you are shallow-brain to swallow this nonsense.

Originally posted by Rajk999
God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit.cannot be likened to physical objects.
Witness Lee is an idiot to make these comparisons, and you are shallow-brain to swallow this nonsense.

'...And who is the Rock except our God?' (2 Samuel 22:32-34)

'For the LORD your God is a consuming fire...' (Deuteronomy 4:24)

I'm sure there are others.

Originally posted by Rajk999
God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit.cannot be likened to physical objects.
Witness Lee is an idiot to make these comparisons, and you are shallow-brain to swallow this nonsense.

God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit.cannot be likened to physical objects.

The work of God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit is often likened to things in the natural world that we can understand.

The blindness of this heretic Rajk999 cannot appreciate this. But there is hope for some of you.

is not the Holy Spirit likened to "rivers of living water" in John 7?

" He who believes into Me, as the Scripture said, out of his innermost being shall flow rivers of living water.

But this He said concerning the Spirit, whom those who believed into Him were about to receive ..." (See John 7:38,39)

The rock that "followed" the Israelites is said to symbolize Jesus Christ.

" and all drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank of a spiritual ROCK which followed them, and that rock was Christ." ( 1 Cor. 10:4)

Jesus also referred to Himself as the bread which came down out of heaven.

" For the bread of God is He who comes down out of heaven and gives life to the world (John 7:33) ... I am the bread of life (v.48) ... I am the living bread which came down out of heaven ..." (v.51)

God describes Himself with the symbolism of a Rock.

" And you are My witnesses. Is there a God besides Me?

Or is there any other Rock? I do not know of any " (Isaiah 44:8)

What I said was that the divine nature of the Father may be symbolized by the GOLD.
But God the Father is definitely called a "Rock" rendering the heretic Rajk999's opinion null and void once again.

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
'...And who is the Rock except our God?' (2 Samuel 22:32-34)

'For the LORD your God is a consuming fire...' (Deuteronomy 4:24)

I'm sure there are others.

Thankyou.

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
'...And who is the Rock except our God?' (2 Samuel 22:32-34)

'For the LORD your God is a consuming fire...' (Deuteronomy 4:24)

I'm sure there are others.

The Spirit is like the wind John 3:8

Edit: I've read some nice exposition on the Ark of the Covenant being liked to God: the cedar wood, the gold and silver I think it was. These related to humanity, royalty and something else which annoyingly escapes me at the moment.

God, Jehovah, Yeshua, Jesus, Lord, whatever name is ascribed at the time, is manifested in multiple physical forms and described in multiple metaphorical ways. But he is ONE entity. The Lord is ONE?

🙂

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
'...And who is the Rock except our God?' (2 Samuel 22:32-34)

'For the LORD your God is a consuming fire...' (Deuteronomy 4:24)

I'm sure there are others.

God or Christ is a rock. Yes. However it is a different matter for Bible readers to take it upon themselves to make such comparisons on their own where these were not clearly stated, as this can be the beginning of idolatry.

God is a consuming fire is stated in conjuction with the very same sin which many described as the most hated by God. Hence the need to be careful.

Take heed unto yourselves, lest ye forget the covenant of the LORD your God, which he made with you, and make you a graven image, or the likeness of any thing, which the LORD thy God hath forbidden thee. For the LORD thy God is a consuming fire, even a jealous God. When thou shalt beget children, and children's children, and ye shall have remained long in the land, and shall corrupt yourselves, and make a graven image, or the likeness of any thing, and shall do evil in the sight of the LORD thy God, to provoke him to anger🙁Deuteronomy 4:23-25 KJV)

It is even worse when Paul condemned the use of gold and jewelry for one to claim that the works of man likened to gold etc, [again clearly stated by Paul] represents God etc. It is a foolish comparison and unbiblical.

Some Christian sects take this matter of idolatry lightly and use images of Christ and of God and pictures to which they bow down. God cannot be pleased with this.

Sonship and his type treads on dangerous ground.

Originally posted by Rajk999

Sonship and his type treads on dangerous ground.

Your folly is going to be manifested to most Christians here.

Explain how it is "dangerous ground" to appreciate the symbolism of God as a solid Rock.
Explain how it is treading "dangerous ground" for taking faithfully Christ's words that He is " the bread that came down from heaven" ?

The latter reminds us that we need to daily take in Christ and enjoy being nourished, sustained, strengthened by Christ.

How is this "treading dangerous ground" ? ? ?

Or how is it treading "dangerous ground" for appreciating the Father's nature to be as precious as gold or the Son's work in purchasing us as precious silver?

How is it treading dangerous ground to realize and cooperate with the Holy Spirit as He transforms us into something symbolized as precious stones for His temple ?

Any two of the examples above you may use to explain we are treading dangerous ground.