Spirituality

Spirituality

  1. Standard membersonship
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    23 Apr '19 23:14
    @CalJust

    I agree with you that some practices are more important than others - crucially important, actually. Such as loving one another, showing compassion, being forgiving, etc. Laws of the heart.


    Absolutely. And we need His life for that.
    Agreed?


    Others are definitely dependent on the culture of the times, the political and societal issues, and hence cannot be applied to the 21st century.


    Maybe "cannot" is too strong. But culture and time do influence the customs of the believers.

    Viewing the church life through the lense of time and culture is appropriate.

    On these two principles I think we agree.


    I agree.


    Where we disagree, however, is that I would place the issue of locality squarely in the second category, whilst you place it in the first.




    The societal, cultural and geographic landscape has changed unrecognisably from the first century.

    It simply makes no sense to have one "church" in Chicago, and one in Anaheim.

    But - and this remains my biggest objection - this again focuses on external things, rather than on what matters most. In fact, it detracts from those things.

    Which is the stuff in my first category. [/quote]

    If you do not mistake " one church " for one meeting place, one assembly hall, or one location, it is arguable I think.

    The church in Taipei has many meetings halls.

    The church in Jerusalem met in hundreds of houses.
    The same with a number of large cities - multiple meetings places, meeting halls.

    Remember, the church is the called out believers not the physical edifice.

    That is could be problematic in some large cities, I would not deny. But if the way is NOT taken, is that problem free ?

    I wish I could converse more at this moment, But I am actually called away to some things.
  2. Standard membersonship
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    03 May '19 17:141 edit
    If anyone is interested.

    Ron Kangus speaks of the Church history and the history of the Lord's recovery. This message is about Witness Lee's portion, his life and work.

    The History of the Lord's Recovery -- Witness Lee (1) -RK
    YouTube
  3. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    03 May '19 18:06
    @sonship said
    If anyone is interested.

    Ron Kangus speaks of the Church history and the history of the Lord's recovery. This message is about Witness Lee's portion, his life and work.

    The History of the Lord's Recovery -- Witness Lee (1) -RK
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7aKkfgPk_kU
    And to ensure we view that in context, let us not forget Lee's words:

    'The Lord is not building His church in Christendom, which is composed of the apostate Roman Catholic Church and the Protestant denominations. This...is being fulfilled through the Lord's recovery, in which the building of the genuine church is being accomplished...Roman Catholicism and Protestantism, as well as Judaism, all [have] become an organization of Satan.'
  4. Standard membersonship
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    03 May '19 20:191 edit
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke

    Far, far more serious is the blasphemy that you commit by telling the world that God does not exist - atheist.
  5. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    03 May '19 20:25
    @sonship said
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke

    Far, far more serious is the blasphemy that you commit by telling the world that God does not exist - atheist.
    Says the man flogging snake oil...
  6. SubscriberFMF
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    04 May '19 00:021 edit
    @sonship said
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke

    Far, far more serious is the blasphemy that you commit by telling the world that God does not exist - atheist.
    Why address this comment to Ghost of a Duke? It's clearly for the consumption of people who believe in blasphemy.

    How about:

    'Hey everybody, fellow Christians! It's very serious... the blasphemy that Ghost of a Duke is committing by telling the world that God does not exist - he's an atheist!'

    Fixed.
  7. Standard membersonship
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    06 May '19 15:082 edits
    @FMF

    Whether one will have to answer for blasphemy preaching that God doesn't exist - time will tell.

    Maybe not.
    Maybe so.

    Maybe Ghost will spend his last moments in existence looking back over his life and saying "Wow. That certainly was weird. Never did figure this life thing out. "

    Time will tell. And you cannot deny that.

    I'm satisfied. Time will tell.
    But I count Jesus as a believable Person and His words credible and worthy of serious attention.
  8. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    06 May '19 15:16
    @sonship said
    @FMF

    Whether one will have to answer for blasphemy preaching that God doesn't exist - time will tell.

    Maybe not.
    Maybe so.

    Maybe Ghost will spend his last moments in existence looking back over his life and saying "Wow. That certainly was weird. Never did figure this life thing out. "

    Time will tell. And you cannot deny that.

    I'm satisfied. Time will t ...[text shortened]... l.
    But I count Jesus as a believable Person and His words credible and worthy of serious attention.
    And of course, whether one will have to answer for blasphemy preaching that man is to be mingled with God,...time will tell.
  9. Standard membersonship
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    06 May '19 15:20
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke

    And of course, whether one will have to answer for blasphemy preaching that man is to be mingled with God,...time will tell.


    Fair enough.
    Fair enough.

    However, Ithink we Christians are on the right track to believe that after receiving Jesus Christ into their spirits they have begun that process.
  10. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    06 May '19 15:23
    @sonship said
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke

    And of course, whether one will have to answer for blasphemy preaching that man is to be mingled with God,...time will tell.


    Fair enough.
    Fair enough.

    However, Ithink we Christians are on the right track to believe that after receiving Jesus Christ into their spirits they have begun that process.
    You have pinned your colours to a very strange horse.

    Good luck to you.
  11. Standard membersonship
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    07 May '19 15:251 edit
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke

    The existence of the local churches I have experienced is evidence enough that transformation is indeed taking place. We could not be one otherwise.

    So I believe we have a foretaste of a fuller taste to come - an appetizer, a down payment.

    The Lord Jesus is building us up in this age and preparing us for the age to come.

    It is hard for many Christians not to anticipate that the transformation of going from unbeliever to believer miraculously and the ongoing pull of sanctification is evidence of more in store.
  12. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    07 May '19 15:27
    @sonship said
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke

    The existence of the local churches I have experienced is evidence enough that transformation is indeed taking place. We could not be one otherwise.

    So I believe we have a foretaste of a fuller taste to come - an appetizer, a down payment.

    The Lord Jesus is building us up in this age and preparing us for the age to come.
    Is that evidence verifiable?
  13. Standard membersonship
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    07 May '19 15:332 edits
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke

    Is that evidence verifiable?


    I just implied that it was.
    If I thought it totally was not I would not have written the previous post.

    Your microscope or other scientific instrument cannot verify salvation.
    And every evidence of Jesus being God become a man was very strong. In spite of this there are those who have a vested interest in claiming that they see no evidence.

    Do you think those who cried out "Crucify Him! Crucify Him!" had not seen ANY evidence at all of His claims to be God's Son? I think they didn't want to believe any evidence that He was the Son of God.

    Pushback expected from you is - "Are you comparing yourself to Jesus then? "

    Get it off your chest if that's your next move. Then I'll deal with that complaint.
  14. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    07 May '19 15:36
    @sonship said
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke

    Is that evidence verifiable?


    I just implied that it was.
    If I thought it totally was not I would not have written the previous post.

    Your microscope or other scientific instrument cannot verify salvation.
    And every evidence of Jesus being God become a man was very strong. In spite of this there are those who have a vested inter ...[text shortened]... then? "

    Get it off your chest if that's your next move. Then I'll deal with that complaint.
    So actually no, it's not verifiable.
  15. Standard membersonship
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    07 May '19 15:435 edits
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke

    I think the Gospel certainly it adequately verifiable.
    Yet we do walk by faith and not by sight.

    You accept a lot more and other things with less then 100% mathematical like PROOF.

    Be honest. Concerning the words of Jesus you set a much higher bar because much more seems to be at stake.

    To think one needs forgiveness from God is an immediate admission that his ego is not on the throne of the universe. And some fight that with everything in them. - ie. "It cannot BE that I am not the master of all things."

    Part of the process of submitting to the love of Christ is realizing that some of that opposition rising up in your mind is not completely you. Some of it is Satan's fear of losing his GRIP on you.

    So there is a mixture of fears. Some is the sinner's. But some is the sinner's master - the Devil. Each slave of sin he loses is a tactical further defeat to his kingdom.

    A critical mass of lost captives will mean his departure into the lake of fire.
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