06 Dec '05 01:44>
Originally posted by DarfiusHe hoped for a life(+eternal) in the Lord.The story shows evidence he was saved...even though part was through stupid people.
Which means what?
Originally posted by KneverKnightI actually don’t think I believe in free will, if by that is meant unconstrained, or unbounded, choice. Some things about my existence have been and are determined; some circumstances that I confront seem to admit of only a single determined outcome (or, at best, a constrained set of possible outcomes, determined by the circumstance). There are still “openings” or “areas of uncertainty” in which I can make (am compelled to make?) decisions; the outcomes of those decisions are a priori indeterminate. The phrase I learned in economics is “constrained choice.”
If God is the Creator of All Things, then of course there is no free will but His.
We are puppets!
Originally posted by KneverKnightActually, I think it is the other way around.
If God is the Creator of All Things, then of course there is no free will but His.
We are puppets!
Originally posted by vistesdWell yes, you are born with a particular set of genes into some economic circumstance which limits your choices, but you still have free will within these constraints.
I actually don’t think I believe in free will, if by that is meant unconstrained, or unbounded, choice. Some things about my existence have been and are determined; some circumstances that I confront seem to admit of only a single determined outcome (or, at best, a constrained set of possible outcomes, determined by the circumstance). There are sti ...[text shortened]... in economics is “constrained choice.”
And this regardless of the existence of a creator God.
Originally posted by KneverKnightI get your point, and it's a good one. I just wanted to take the opportunity to put some natural constraints on the concept of free will, that's all.
Well yes, you are born with a particular set of genes into some economic circumstance which limits your choices, but you still have free will within these constraints.
I think ...
There was a commercial for KFC on tv where a woman walks into a clearing in the woods bearing a very large table cloth and casts it down, creating a setting for a v ...[text shortened]... here is a God that created everything, then surely there is no free will and we are all puppets.
Originally posted by vistesdI have a question, I guess two questions for you.
I get your point, and it's a good one. I just wanted to take the opportunity to put some natural constraints on the concept of free will, that's all.
On the other hand, No.1 Marauder had a lovely comment in another thread about a God who is a bit of a gambler, who decides to take risks, who doesn't know all the outcomes...
Originally posted by KellyJayBig question(s)! I would say, tentatively anyway, that God would have to not know in order to be fair. (I am trying to avoid the Calvinist double-predestination plot here.) That, however, raises a whole host of other questions—salvation versus condemnation, for one—depending on ones’ understanding of God…
I have a question, I guess two questions for you.
Do you think is is possible for God to be fair even if He knew the
outcome, or the only way to be fair is if God didn't know? Can God
be honest and all knowing at the same time?
Kelly
Originally posted by KneverKnightI guess that’s what we try to do with concepts like omnipotent, omniscient, etc., etc.
I wonder if we'll ever construct the perfect God.
Originally posted by joelekThis necessitates denying that humans have free will, and accepting that we only experience an illusion of it. You cannot believe both that God is omniscient and that humans have free will. If you accept one as true, you must deny the other.
But stop trying to determine IF God is omniscient from your own arguments. He is! What you need to do is bring the rest of your beliefs inline with that TRUTH.
Originally posted by joelekNow, if you don't believe Scripture, and therefore don't take the Bible's word that God is omniscient, then really, I'm not sure why you're even discussing this particular topic.
Many on here seem to be missing a very simple point. There have been many arguments given. Dr. S is very logical with his, and as far as human logic goes, his conclusions are good.
However, the question is, what does Scripture say? Does it teach the omniscience of God? The answer is, "YES!" For example, "Jesus, knowing all that was going to happen ...[text shortened]... God is omniscient, then really, I'm not sure why you're even discussing this particular topic.