18 Oct 22
@fmf saidApparently a just universe doesn't register with you. You accept the idea of a universe where injustice exists,(indisputably) but your cognitive powers run into a wall imagining the existence of a just universe where evil doesn't exist.
There is injustice in the universe. About this, I think there is no dispute. But why do some people believe that the indisputable fact there is injustice in the universe means there MUST indisputably be some sort of supernatural justice?
18 Oct 22
@josephw saidI’m sure everyone can ‘imagine’ a just universe just as they can imagine a dragon that breathes flowers instead of fire but none of the above are demonstrably in existence.
Apparently a just universe doesn't register with you. You accept the idea of a universe where injustice exists,(indisputably) but your cognitive powers run into a wall imagining the existence of a just universe where evil doesn't exist.
Only people are unjust in their actions, the universe can only seem subjectively unjust.
The asteroid that allegedly wiped out the dinosaurs left the field open for the evolution of mammals. From the dinosaurs subjective viewpoint the universe could be seen as unjust but in reality it was nothing personal.
@fmf saidI would suggest that without a universally accepted set of laws, the definition of the term "injustice" is pretty hazy.
There is injustice in the universe. About this, I think there is no dispute. But why do some people believe that the indisputable fact there is injustice in the universe means there MUST indisputably be some sort of supernatural justice?
As the old saying goes: "One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter"
19 Oct 22
@mchill saidIt's ok by me if you don't think there is injustice in the world or if your definition of injustice is hazy or if you can't answer my question without there being "universally accepted set of laws". It's ok. I have a knack of coming up with questions you can't or don't want to address.
I would suggest that without a universally accepted set of laws, the definition of the term "injustice" is pretty hazy.
@josephw saidYou accept the idea of a universe where injustice exists
Apparently a just universe doesn't register with you. You accept the idea of a universe where injustice exists,(indisputably) but your cognitive powers run into a wall imagining the existence of a just universe where evil doesn't exist.
I accept that there are murderers and rapists, for example, that never get caught or prosecuted. I accept that "life sucks" in this way. Speculation about whether they are punished in some way after they die does not affect the fact that there are those who don't get caught or prosecuted and it "sucks".
19 Oct 22
@kevcvs57 saidThat's simplifying and putting it mildly. The history of our planet involves torture and hellish places. Add to the asteroid a decline of the food chain and volcanic activity that contributed to the dinosaurs' demise (https://www.space.com/dinosaur-extinction-volcanoes-aided-asteroid-impact). Reality isn't JUST confined to science
The asteroid that allegedly wiped out the dinosaurs left the field open for the evolution of mammals. From the dinosaurs subjective viewpoint the universe could be seen as unjust but in reality it was nothing personal.
19 Oct 22
@kevcvs57 saidWell kev, my comment was directed at FMF's assertion that the universe is undisputedly unjust.
I’m sure everyone can ‘imagine’ a just universe just as they can imagine a dragon that breathes flowers instead of fire but none of the above are demonstrably in existence.
Only people are unjust in their actions, the universe can only seem subjectively unjust.
The asteroid that allegedly wiped out the dinosaurs left the field open for the evolution of mammals. From the d ...[text shortened]... rs subjective viewpoint the universe could be seen as unjust but in reality it was nothing personal.
The universe, matter, has no mind with which to make unjust actions.
But there is a mind that directs the course of nature.
That's the dispute here.
19 Oct 22
@fmf saidBut why do some people believe that the indisputable fact there is injustice in the universe means there MUST indisputably be some sort of supernatural justice?
You accept the idea of a universe where injustice exists
I accept that there are murderers and rapists, for example, that never get caught or prosecuted. I accept that "life sucks" in this way. Speculation about whether they are punished in some way after they die does not affect the fact that there are those who don't get caught or prosecuted and it "sucks".
If there was no justice, then you wouldn't know there is injustice.
@fmf saidIt's ok by me if you don't think there is injustice in the world or if your definition of injustice is hazy
It's ok by me if you don't think there is injustice in the world or if your definition of injustice is hazy or if you can't answer my question without there being "universally accepted set of laws". It's ok. I have a knack of coming up with questions you can't or don't want to address.
It's OK by me also, but that's only part of what I wrote. You're skipping over the part about laws. With laws, justice can be clearly defined, without them, the definition of justice (or injustice) is meaningless since there is no basis with which to judge anyone's actions. I know it's fun to cherry pick selected parts someone's post here, but sometimes you have to look at the whole post - even if it's not what you want to accept... 😏
