Originally posted by SaintCathalThe universe is too complex, too intricate, and too finely adapted to have occurred randomly or by chance. It exhibits enough order and design in its finely tuned interworking components that we are compelled to infer the existence of a designer. Not only can we infer a designer's existence, but we can deduce some of the character of the designer from the nature of his design. Since his wondrous creation is not only breathtakingly beautiful, but is also remarkably conducive to the propagation of human life, we may therefore conclude that this designer is a beneficent and loving one.
All you have to do is provide me with a well thought-out, logical argument for belief in god.
I have a feeling I'll be keeping all the cookies for myself.
Thanks.
As this short presentation of the teleological argument for the existence of God is both well thought out and logical, it meets your criteria. PM me and I will provide you with the address where you can mail my cookie.
25 Dec 08
Originally posted by rwingettSir, you've made my day and now that you have, I'll send those cookies through a chess game, yes?
The universe is too complex, too intricate, and too finely adapted to have occurred randomly or by chance. It exhibits enough order and design in its finely tuned interworking components that we are compelled to infer the existence of a designer. Not only can we infer a designer's existence, but we can deduce some of the character of the designer from the n ...[text shortened]... eets your criteria. PM me and I will provide you with the address where you can mail my cookie.
That was bloody brilliant.
25 Dec 08
Originally posted by SaintCathalWhat? It was only a representative cookie? Something like a wafer and the "body of Christ"? As its been nearly a year since my last game I would have preferred a simple oatmeal raisin. But I shall break my chess fast for your transubstantial cookie. Its caloric content will certainly be less.
Sir, you've made my day and now that you have, I'll send those cookies through a chess game, yes?
That was bloody brilliant.
25 Dec 08
2 edits
Originally posted by rwingett…The universe is too complex, too intricate, and too finely adapted to have occurred randomly or by chance..…
The universe is too complex, too intricate, and too finely adapted to have occurred randomly or by chance. It exhibits enough order and design in its finely tuned interworking components that we are compelled to infer the existence of a designer. Not only can we infer a designer's existence, but we can deduce some of the character of the designer from the n ...[text shortened]... eets your criteria. PM me and I will provide you with the address where you can mail my cookie.
Why would a “god” be necessary for it to exist because of something other than random chance?
How do you know that the physical constants are inevitably what they are and couldn’t have been any other set of values thus there is no “coincidence” that they are just right for life (how can it be a “coincidence” if there is no alternative possibility?) and thus there was no “fine tuning” or "adapting" of the physical contents necessary to make life possible?
Alternatively, IF it is possible for the physical constants to have had completely different values (a big “IF&rdquo😉 then how do you know that there are not an infinite number of universes (because “every possible universe exists” -not saying that is true -its just a hypothesis) each one with a different set of values for its physical constants thus it is inevitable that some have a set just right for life and thus it is inevitable that we live in just such an ideal universe ( else we wouldn’t live in the universe we are in and also we wouldn’t exist to be able to ask ourselves “isn’t it a spectacular absurd coincidence that all the physical constants are just right in our universe to be able for us to live and thus ask ourselves this very same question!!!? )
Either way, no “god” is necessary.
25 Dec 08
Originally posted by Andrew HamiltonAh, Mr. Hamilton, my argument need not be true to be valid. Any dime store logician can tell you that. My task was merely to present a logical and well thought out argument for the existence of god, which I have done. Nit-picking at either my premises or my conclusion is beyond the scope of the challenge.
[b]…The universe is too complex, too intricate, and too finely adapted to have occurred randomly or by chance..…
Why would a “god” be necessary for it to exist because of something other than random chance?
How do you know that the physical constants are inevitably what they are and couldn’t have been any other set of values thus there is n ...[text shortened]... ive and thus ask ourselves this very same question!!!? )
Either way, no “god” is necessary.[/b]
25 Dec 08
God or Gods, it or its has really no actually existence of it's nature.
And the logical rule is. No picture no proof.
Don't see it, don't believe it.
But according to the bible 'God' is real. And to what part is a book written by mere humans would prove that a mighty power of an abnormal being exist and created us?
No to evolution? No to Apes and growing and learning, what about our truly, the Dinosaurs?
So the mere thought of 6 billion people coming from two makes me want to LOL LOL.
25 Dec 08
1 edit
Originally posted by rwingettFair enough 🙂
Ah, Mr. Hamilton, my argument need not be true to be valid. Any dime store logician can tell you that. My task was merely to present a logical and well thought out argument for the existence of god, which I have done. Nit-picking at either my premises or my conclusion is beyond the scope of the challenge.
No more Nit-picking, flee-picking, nose-picking etc.
25 Dec 08
Originally posted by SaintCathalDon't see it, don't believe it. But that doesn't mean you can write it off as necessarily being false. There are simply insubstantial grounds for believing it to be true.
God or Gods, it or its has really no actually existence of it's nature.
And the logical rule is. No picture no proof.
Don't see it, don't believe it.
But according to the bible 'God' is real. And to what part is a book written by mere humans would prove that a mighty power of an abnormal being exist and created us?
No to evolution? No to Apes ...[text shortened]... saurs?
So the mere thought of 6 billion people coming from two makes me want to LOL LOL.
God can be real without adhering to the bible. God and evolution are perfectly compatible with one another, if one does not accept biblical literalism (which most Christians do not).
25 Dec 08
Originally posted by SaintCathalConsider the alternative.
All you have to do is provide me with a well-thought-out, logical argument for belief in god.
I have a feeling I'll be keeping all the cookies for myself.
Thanks.
You're all alone. You're going to die. You will never feel anything, or see anything, or think of anything ever again. You will cease to exist. Your life means nothing at all. No purpose. No reason. No hope!
25 Dec 08
Originally posted by SaintCathalMan, you non-believers are inexhaustible! Simply go to the Bible and ask God to show you, and if you sincerely believe, He will reveal Himself, although He will do so in His own time. Faith is required, so unless you are ready to ask in faith, then forget about it and eat your cookies. Enjoy them with milk, and Merry Christmas.
All you have to do is provide me with a well-thought-out, logical argument for belief in god.
I have a feeling I'll be keeping all the cookies for myself.
Thanks.
26 Dec 08
Being Atheist isn't so bad, is it?
I'm alone half the time, what would being alone have anything to do with believing in Christ?
Zeus and God are the same to me, are they not? Bot Imaginary and Gods.
They have books written about them, why aren't we all greeks and worshiping thunder, water, whatever?
And by the way, I never had faith nor did I ever try. I'm always open to new things but one is not to follow a trend of people.
Far too young and naive.
But cookies for the rest of you.
26 Dec 08
Originally posted by SaintCathalI think that's very sad. What've you to look forward to but nothingness. With Christ you have eternity to look forward to.
And and in my thread description I didn't say I believed or didn't believe, I just wanted a well-thought out argument in any case, I am not a believer so that works, right?
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26 Dec 08
Originally posted by dystoniacWow. What a compelling suggestion. Atheists should just believe in God, and then, once they truly believe, they will have proof.
Man, you non-believers are inexhaustible! Simply go to the Bible and ask God to show you, and if you sincerely believe, He will reveal Himself, although He will do so in His own time. Faith is required, so unless you are ready to ask in faith, then forget about it and eat your cookies. Enjoy them with milk, and Merry Christmas.