Who give human life?

While considered the pinnacle of creation, man is by no means the centerpiece of the universe: it just appears that way temporarily! God perpetuates human life as the means to resolve the angelic conflict. In man, God created the duplicate conditions which pre-existed man, during the prehistoric angelic revolt. Volition is the similar thread. Just as Lucifer fell via an act of his volition, Adam fell, and with him, the human race. The perpetuation of the sin nature must always be attributed to the volition of Adam. God graciously grants human life; Adam corrupts human life with spiritual death.

God provides a means for humanity to escape the spiritual death inherited at birth. Jesus Christ as our substitute died on the cross for all our sins. One simple act of faith in His work imparts not only spiritual life, but also a way to defeat the sin problem. From Romans 5:8:
"But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died [as a substitute] for us."

Human life exists from the moment the fetus emerges from the womb, when God "breathes" soul life into the newly born child, and continues until soul and body are separated at physical death. From Ecc. 3:2:
"A time to give birth,
and a time to die."
Isa. 9:6:
"For a child will be born to us..."
Matt. 11:11:
"Truly, I say to you, among those born of women..."
Luke 2:10, 11:
" ...for today in the city of David there has been born for you a Savior..."
The angels did not rejoice at His conception, but rather, His birth. Each of these passages establish birth as the moment of human life, not conception, even though conception was understood. Job also confirms this, in many places.
Job 14:1:
"Man, who is born of woman,
Is short-lived [birth and living equated] and full of turmoil."
15:14:
"What is man, that he should be pure,
Or he who is born of woman, that he should be righteous?"
38:21:
"You know, for you were born then [mentality, a part of the soul, is not available until birth].
And the number of your days is great!"
Or, indirectly, as in 3:11:
"Why did I not die at birth,
Come forth from the womb and expire?"
Here, Job is acknowledging that he cannot die unless he has first been born, and cannot be born, without separating from the womb.
Or, more clearly, as in 10:18-19:
"Why then have You brought me out of [outside] the womb [why have I been born]?
Would that I had died and no eye had seen me!
I should have been as though I had not been [human existence],
Carried from [out of] womb [birth] to tomb [physical death]."
Later, in chapter 10, Job has become a mess of self-pity, plunges into an overemotional, irrational state, and begins to blur the distinction between the mediate and immediate creations of God. He begins blaming God as the antagonist, and falsely protrays God's character.

Use of the Hebrew preposition min, or, from, followed by the noun beten, or, womb, combines the two to form one word, mibeten, or, from the womb. These three are used in Job 1:21; 3:11; 10:19. The preposition min is emphatic when used with verbs that express or infer separation or removal. When so used, the meaning of min becomes 'away from,' 'separated from,' or 'out from.' Significantly, the basic and primary lexical use of min is separation. Thus, when mibeten is used with the verbs 'come,' as in Job 1:21, 'come forth' (3:11) and 'carried' (10:19), this use clarifies 'from the womb' to mean separation from the womb, and thus life.

David's use of mibeten also indicates an understanding of life beginning at birth, here in Psalm 22:9,10:
"Yet You are He who did bring me forth from [out of] the womb [mibeten];
You did make me trust when upon my mother's breasts.
Upon You was I cast [out] from birth [the womb];
You have been my God [apart] from my mother's womb [mibeten]."
The first mibeten in v9 follows the verb of separation, 'bring forth.' The next in v10 does not follow a verb of separation, but is parallel in meaning with v9.

The 22nd Psalm is a very important Messianic Psalm, as it also contains the topic of the crucifixion of the Messiah. While David is desribing himself in the passage, he is also prophesying the thoughts and word of his greater Son, Jesus Christ (22:1, Matt. 27:46; Mark 15:34). Verses 9 and 10 speak of the birth of Christ--- of His removal from the womb of His mother. He is not dependent upon God in the womb, only outside of the womb. Nor is there trust inside of the womb, as there is no human life with which to do the trusting.

Psalm 58:3:
"The wicked are estranged [out] from the womb;
These who speak lies go astray from birth [literally, from the womb (mibeten)]."

This verse indicates there can be no wickedness until a person be separated from the womb. At the moment of birth, as soul life is imparted, the sin nature is activated. No one can be 'wicked' or 'speak lies' until they are born.

Isaiah uses mibeten and yatsar, which is 'to form' or 'to create.' In Gen. 2:7, yatsar was referring to God's immediate formation of Adam's biological life. Yet, after Gen.2 yatsar no longer points to His immediate creation of biological life, as all biological life since the Fall has been mediate, through procreation. Thus, when yatsar is used wtih mibeten, it describes the immediate creation of human life by God, after separation from the womb.
Isa. 44:2:
"Thus says the LORD who made you
And formed [yatsar, created] you [your human life] from [after leaving] the womb [mibeten], who will help you,
'Do not fear, O Jacob My servant;
And you Jeshurun whom I have chosen."
44:24:
"Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, and the one who formed [yatsar, created] you [human life] from [after leaving] the womb [mibeten],
'I, the LORD, am maker of all things,
Stretching out the heavens by Myself,
And spreading the earth all alone."
The temporal uses of mibeten in the excerpts mark the point of physical birth, after which time human life continues: "the anerior limit of a continuous period." Min used temporally like this can be translated 'since' or 'after.' This dramatic poetic imagery is used by Isaiah to depict birth.

By analogy, Isaiah portrays birth as the beginning point of both the race and the spiritual life of Israel. He also uses the birth of one man, Jacob, to personify the physical and spiritual birth of the entire race, the nation of Israel (44:1,2: 49:5).
The Jewish race began with the spiritual birth of Abraham and was perpetuated racially through the physical birth of his son, Issac, and grandson, Jacob. 44:2 and 24 represent the begining of the new race as if it were the birth of one person. Jacob was 'formed' as the servant of God after leaving the womb, the "Jeshurun whom I hav chosen." As with Jacob, the existence of the Jewish race began after leaving the womb.
Old Testament Jews were not simply a race of those born with the physical genes of Abraham, Issac, and Jacob. Those who expressed faith in God were regenerated. The second birth, the spiritual birth marked the beginning of the new racial species, the true Jew. True Jews were not only born physically alive as a race of people, but were also reborn spiritually alive through faith in the Lord as the chosen people of God.
The physical birth and spiritual birth of the nation Israel represent a point of time after which (min) the physical life and the spiritual life continues. Isaiah's message accepts human life as beginning at birth. However, his analogy would be ineffective if birth as the beginning of human life were not accepted as true by those who heard the message.
Isa. 49:5:
"And now says the Lord, who formed [yatsar, created] Me [human life, the humanity of Jesus Christ] from [after leaving] the womb [mibeten] to be His Servant,
To bring Jacob back to Him, in order that Israel might be gathered to Him."
In another temporal use of mibeten, this portrays the birth of the One who will gather Israel and bring Jacob back to Him. From the time of His birth, this child was destined to be the "Servant" of God for Israel's redemption.
49:1:
"Listen to Me,, O islands [Greek],
And pay attention, you peoples from afar [Gentiles].
The Lord called Me from [after leaving] the womb [mibeten];
[Out] from the body of My mother He named Me."
As eternal God, Jesus Christ became true humanity at the time He was separated from the womb. Isaiah's imagery of separation from the womb using the preposition min sets the terminus a quo of redemption. Isaiah's effective communication depends upon his readers' understanding of birth as the beginning of life. As human life begins at birth, the redemptive work for Israel and the Gentiles began at the birth of Messiah, culminating at the cross.

Ek?

The Greek preposition ek is the best indication of the original intended meaning of the Hebrew min. As asserted here already, min is to mean "out from," "separated from," or "after leaving," in the passages quoted already from Job, the Psalms and Isaiah. Three hundred years before Christ, with the Septuagint translation from Hebrew to Greek, the translators used the Greek preposition ek to represent min.

The primary purpose of ek is to to denote separation. Mibeten is represented by two Greek phrases, ek koilia, and ek gastros. In each of the references already noted, these phrases are preceded with a verb of motion. Ek following verbs of motion "introduces the place from which the separation takes place." As such, ek koilia or ek gastros in Job and the Psalms signify "out of" or "separated from the womb."
The preposition also has a temporal sense. Mibeten, translated ek koilia in the LXX version of Isaiah 49:1, is noted as a primary example of temporal interpretation of ek, "of the time when something begins." Thus this verse is seen in light of "from birth," denoting "from birth on." All four of the previously cited verses from Isaiah are temporal usages, thus: out from the womb, out of, or separated from the womb.

Human life begins with the impartation of the soul life at birth. While the soul is immortal, this does not qualify a person to live with God forever. Soul life can live forever in hell. God's qualification for life with Him is to receive eternal life, regeneration or the second birth. John 3:1-7, in the passage involving Nicodemus numerates this concept.
In this passage, the Lord Jesus Christ does not tell Nicodemus that he must be conceived again, but born again. Both participants in the conversation equate human life with birth. Jesus Christ underlines the basis for God's choice of entrance into His kingdom, which is not the genes of Abraham, Issac and Jacob.
"Born of water" in verse 5 implies physical birth, not water baptism. Water baptism is never a condition for entrance into "the kingdom of God." Spirit baptism which occurs at the moment of faith in Christ, is a prerequisite and an integral part of being "born of the Spirit," not "born of water."
The water association with the physical birth refers to the rupturing of the membrane surrounding the fetus as birth becomes imminent.
Physical birth includes spiritual death, as introduced in the need to be born again. Jesus here claims both physical birth and spiritual birth are necessary for entrance into the Kingdom of God. The entire focus of Scripture, relative to the beginning of life, is at birth.
However, there are some misunderstood passages, which should be examined, such as Psalm 139:13; Jeremiah 1:5; Luke 1:15 and 41; Luke 11:27,28; Exodous 21:22-25, among them.

On the surface, there appear to be a few passages, which contradict or conflict with what has been put forth so far in this thread.
Psalm 139:13
For You did form [qanah] my inward parts;
You did weave me in my mother's womb [bebeten].
I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
Wonderful are Your works,
Any my soul knows it very well.

Obviously, this is an oft-quoted passage as proof that human life resides in the womb. Stopping short here, one could conclude just this idea; however, the concept must be given a full measure of study, not partial.
The Hebrew preposition be with the noun beten combine to form bebeten, meaning "in the womb." Here, David is undoubtedly portraying construction inside the womb, not outside.
What are "inward parts?" The term refers literally to physical or internal organs, and in this case, indicates the development of biological life. Once internal organs and the format soul are sufficiently formed, the fetus separates from the womb, and is imparted with soul life from God. The fetus then becomes a human being, able to exist independently of the mother.
The verb used to designate formation of this biological life does not imply immediate creation, but rather, mediate creation: qanah, "to get" or "to acquire." Traducianists and Creationists on this point will likely agree. Even though this verse attributes God with forming the inward parts of the fetus, the formation is an indirect or mediate one. Nothing in this verse equates the action as immediate. This verse certainly exalts the biological life within the womb of the mother, but does not attribute the formation of the life immediately to God.
Rather, this verse is a tribute to God's everlasting knowledge and design for each of us, even before we were in the womb.

Jeremiah 1:5
Before I formed [yatsar] you in [by means of] the womb I knew you,
And before you were born I consecrated you;
I have appointed you a prophet to the nations.

This verse has convinced many that God forms human life in the womb. However, these two mentioned verses relate to God's omniscience and the divine decree. Jeremiah speaks of his own call to ministry, which, in His omniscience, God knew, even before Jeremiah was born, formed in the womb, or conceived. Moreover, the omniscience of God knew in eternity past all the actual thoughts, decisions, and the actions of Jeremiah and every other human being. The divine decree is the record of these activities. Even though many of those thoughts, decisions and actions are contrary to God's desires, He nonetheless knew these events would take place.
The verb Jeremiah uses for formed is yatsar. This use suggests a reference to the formation of his biological life. This same verb is used in Gen 2:7, when God immediately created Adam's biological life. However, yatsar in Jer 1:5, as in Isaiah 44:2 and 24 does not signify immediate, but mediate creation of biological life. God immediately created life but two times prior to the Fall. From that time forward, all biological life is reproduced naturally via conception, and formed in the womb.
Yatsar is preceded by the word 'before' an adverb indicating a time predating the formation of Jeremiah's biological life and his birth. Only in His omniscience could God have known and consecrated Jeremiah before his biological life was formed--- or his soul life was given.
The recipient's of Jeremiah's message were aware that this statement was a reference to a time before any human life existed, in eternity past, as part of the divine decree.
The statement of God's omniscience is not evidence of God's immediate creation of Jeremiah, but a matter of acknowledgement of God's unmatched greatness: before he was born, before he was formed, before he was conceived, Jeremiah was known and consecrated as a prophet, to serve God through the span of five Jewish kings, beginning in 626 BC.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
On the surface, there appear to be a few passages, which contradict or conflict with what has been put forth so far in this thread.
Psalm 139:13
For You did form [qanah] my inward parts;
You did weave me in my mother's womb [bebeten].
I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
Wonderful are Your works,
Any my soul knows it ...[text shortened]... t, to serve God through the span of five Jewish kings, beginning in 626 BC.

Let me know when the treatise is completed: I want to copy it and read it through whole. Thanks.

Luke 1:15
For he [John the Baptist] will be great in the sight of the Lord, and he will drink no wine or liquor; and he will be filled [empowered] with the Holy Spirit, while yet [in the future] in his mother’s womb [ek koilias, “separated from”].

In Gabriel’s prophecy to Zacharias, Elizabeth’s husband, relative to his future son, John, one must understand the meaning of this last phrase, “while yet in his mother’s womb.”
Ek koilias is inadequately translated “in the womb.” Koilias is the ablative singular of koilia, “womb.” The ablative case preceded by the preposition ek denotes separation. Ek infers a connotation of separation, as earlier noted: “out from” or “away from.” The phrase in question should be translated “yet [in the future] separated from his mother’s womb.” Luke continues the same connotation of separation found in the OT with the use of mibeten. The ablative of separation indicates John must be born before he can be empowered by the Holy Spirit.
In OT times, the enduement of the Holy Spirit was available to only a few believers and was bestowed temporarily for the achievement of unusual responsibility. In the Church Age, the Holy Spirit permanently indwells every believer, but John was born under the dispensational policies and procedures of the OT, before the commencement of the Church Age. This announcement by Gabriel (and his subsequent enduement) mark John as a man with a divinely ordained task to perform. John the Baptist will receive a special enduement by the Holy Spirit to accomplish the unique mission of heralding the Messiah, Jesus Christ.
Further, the Scripture always represents the Holy Spirit as being given to human beings who are regenerate. This verse, as well as its context present birth, not the womb, as the beginning of human life.

Luke 1:41
And it came about the when Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby [fetus which will be John the Baptist] leaped in her womb; and Elisabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit.

In Luke 1:35,36 Mary has been informed by the angel Gabriel that while still a virgin, she will conceive and her offspring will be the “Son of God.” Mary is further told that her relative, Elizabeth, who although barren and beyond her childbearing years, has miraculously conceived and is in her sixth month of pregnancy. Following this announcement, Mary visits Elizabeth.

Luke 1:44
For behold, when the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby [brephos, or “fetus”] leaped [moved about] in my womb for [because of] joy [excitement that quickens my pulse].

Upon hearing Mary’s greeting, Elizabeth’s brephos, “the unborn fetus” moved about “in her womb.” Interpretation of this verse in some translations give the impression that the fetus is responding with joy. But is the emotion of joy were already present in the fetus, the fetus would be ensouled, and a possessor of human life. “Joy’ here refers to the emotional reaction of the mother which, combined with the external sound of Mary’s voice, cause the subsequent reflexive movement of the brephos.
Expectant mothers are aware of many stimuli to which the fetus will respond: voices, music, etc. Startle reflex is just one example of reflexive movement or reflex motility.
This is confirmed by Elizabeth’s reaction:

Luke 1:42,43
And she [Elizabeth] cried out with a loud voice [with great emotion], and said, “Blessed among women are you [Mary], and blessed is the fruit of your womb! And how has it happened to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?”

My objections to abortion are hardly theological, so I'm not getting involved -- yet. One question: do you support 3rd trimester abortions?

What I support is really unimportant. What the Bible says about who gives life, and more specifically, human life, is the issue. How anyone wants to apply that is their own business.
Each person is given the opportunity to decide for themselves where the line is drawn for their own consciences; the Bible's line, however, is emphatic.
Some will play it loose and fast, others as safe as hope, others still in the areas in-between. Quite honestly, I'm glad He gave the choice to someone else!

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
What I support is really unimportant. What the Bible says about who gives life, and more specifically, human life, is the issue. How anyone wants to apply that is their own business.
Each person is given the opportunity to decide for themselves where the line is drawn for their own consciences; the Bible's line, however, is emphatic.
Some will play it ...[text shortened]... s still in the areas in-between. Quite honestly, I'm glad He gave the choice to someone else!

C'mon now - off the record. I'll take it as your interpretation, not pontification of doctrine.

Originally posted by Halitose
C'mon now - off the record. I'll take it as your interpretation, not pontification of doctrine.

Quite honestly, I'm glad He gave the choice to someone else!

Luke 11:27,28

And it came about while He [Jesus Christ] said these things [teaching on demonism], one of the women in the crowd raised her voice, and said to Him, “Blessed is the womb that bore You, and the breasts at which You nursed.”

While teaching, the Lord Jesus Christ is rudely interrupted by a woman in the crowd who is attempting to change the topic from demonism to motherhood. She is more enamored with her own opinion than hearing the word of God. With her outburst, she implies that motherhood is to be praised for His existence. While overtly introducing a false doctrine, she unconsciously distinguishes between sustaining biological life in the womb and nourishing human life at the mother’s breast.
Instead of arguing with the woman, the Lord Jesus Christ simply replies with truth:

But He said, “On the contrary, blessed are those who hear the word of God. and observe [obey] it.”

The first word in reply from Jesus is menoun, a classical Greek particle meaning “on the contrary.” This one word particle was used when responding to an assertion which was either partially or fully wrong, prior to supplying the correction to the assertion. This particle reveals Jesus’ disagreement with the woman’s outcry. The Lord’s correction addresses the issue of the source of blessing.
In ignoring the woman’s contention, Jesus rejects the womb as the source of human life and blessing. This woman has stated what many people wrongly believe: the womb supplies human life and, therefore, blessing to humanity. She attempts to use Jesus as a pawn to advance the superiority of women because she erroneously believes women carry human life in their wombs. But Jesus discounts the gender and womb issue, focusing instead on the real issues: hearing “the word of God” for blessing.
The woman’s false concept could have been corrected had she learned and ‘observed’ the Word of God. Ironically, the greatest blessing to the human race was standing in front of her. Jesus was teaching His audience to consider God’s absolute truth, not mere human opinion and ideas.

Double post. Windows 48.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Quite honestly, I'm glad He gave the choice to someone else!

???

Originally posted by Halitose
???

The question is not one that can be answered by a man.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
The question is not one that can be answered by a man.

hehe, thankfully thats true....