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Originally posted by FMFI certainly think that I have some sort of control over which notions I accept or reject, since I am in control of my thought processes. Do you not control your own thought processes? When exposed to a new idea, you are the one that 'evaluates evidence and the plausibility of the logic and arguments' using your brain (I should hope). The only way that could happen 'out of your control', would be if you were not in control of your thoughts.
Plenty of things are within our control. We control what we expose ourselves to, who we talk to, and things like how long we pursue such things. But, as I said, when arriving at faith and beliefs regarding supernatural beings and phenomena [like immortality and "sin"] ~ things which cannot actually be demonstrated to exist ~ I don't think [i]starting to believe[ ...[text shortened]... testimony' is available, find themselves believing certain things rather than choosing to do so.
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkI think I've addressed this. You said that you don't believe what I've said. That's fine. We clearly disagree about whether people can decide or choose to believe things that they simply don't believe in the realm of supernatural notions for which there is no concrete proof ~ nor can they decide to simply unbelieve them.
I certainly think that I have some sort of control over which notions I accept or reject, since I am in control of my thought processes. Do you not control your own thought processes? When exposed to a new idea, you are the one that 'evaluates evidence and the plausibility of the logic and arguments' using your brain (I should hope). The only way that could happen 'out of your control', would be if you were not in control of your thoughts.
They can have control over their thought processes in so far as exposing themselves to ideas and talking to people about them etc., but they can't choose to believe in something like "sin" or "the afterlife" ; I think, in fact, what happens is they find themselves believing it ~ they realize it. and it isn't a "decision".
But we've been over this time and time again. Is there some way in which you want to move the conversation on, or perhaps back to the 'purpose in life topic'?
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkI didn't "decide" to become a Christian. And I didn't "decide" to stop being one either. The process of reflection, and the willingness and open mindedness needed to reappraise my faith, was under my control, but I can't say I decided to stop believing in Christ; I came to a realization that I didn't.
So everything you or anyone else believes is out of their control. How convenient. Sorry but I don't believe you.
Originally posted by FMFConveniently, if it turns out to be true, then it 'won't be your fault', for rejecting it because that was out of your control.
I didn't "decide" to become a Christian. And I didn't "decide" to stop being one either. The process of reflection, and the willingness and open mindedness needed to reappraise my faith, was under my control, but I can't say I decided to stop believing in Christ; I came to a realization that I didn't.
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkWe are not talking about moral or immoral decisions that affect - negatively or otherwise - other people here, or about morally unsound beliefs translated into actions for which I am responsible and at fault.. We are, instead, talking about believing things in the realm of the supernatural for which you offer no concrete proof. Explain what you mean by the word "fault" in this context.
If your beliefs are not a product of the choices you make then then it's not your fault that you believe what you believe. That's the gist of what you are saying isn't it?
Originally posted by FMFIf people can't decide to believe things and someone just happens to be an atheist, and happens to believe there is no absolute right or wrong and murders a million people because of those beliefs it's not their fault right since they didn't choose those beliefs.
We are not talking about moral or immoral decisions that affect - negatively or otherwise - other people here, or about morally unsound beliefs translated into actions for which I am responsible and at fault.. We are, instead, talking about believing things in the realm of the supernatural for which you offer no concrete proof. Explain what you mean by the word "fault" in this context.
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkSo ultimately your ridiculous assertion that people choose belief is a similarly ridiculous attempt to try and blame atheists for not believing in God?
If people can't decide to believe things and someone just happens to be an atheist, and happens to believe there is no absolute right or wrong and murders a million people because of those beliefs it's not their fault right since they didn't choose those beliefs.
