Originally posted by Esoteric Go back for the last 20 years and tell me how many English clubs have won the UEFA Cup and Champions League.
EDIT: Going back 15 years (champions league. Am working on the UEFA cup).
English Winners
Liverpool - 2005
Man U - 1999
Total - 2
English Runner Up
Arsenal - 2006
Total - 1
Italian Winners
AC Milan - 1990, 1994, 2003
Juve ...[text shortened]... have only had 3 finals appearances in the last 15 years, while Spain had 8 and the Italians 11.
Why did you pick that particular time period it wouldn't be to exclude Between 1975 and 1985, when nine English teams played in the final of the European Cup, and eight times an English team lifted the trophy would it? Also don't forget we were banned for 3 years (was it?) in 1985 and also this year 2007 with 3 teams in the semi final the worst result is a mere finalist, however we could have 2 finalists, especially when you consider the english teams are first 3 in the betting.
Originally posted by stevetodd Why did you pick that particular time period it wouldn't be to exclude Between 1975 and 1985, when nine English teams played in the final of the European Cup, and eight times an English team lifted the trophy would it? Also don't forget we were banned for 3 years (was it?) in a985 and also this year 2007 with 3 teams in the semi final the worst result is a ...[text shortened]... d have 2 finalists, especially when you consider the english teams are fisrt 3 in the betting.
It's as far back as i could find in a short amount of time. But i think going back further than 15 to 20 years really is irrelevant in this argument as were are discussing current performance.
Originally posted by Esoteric It's as far back as i could find in a short amount of time. But i think going back further than 15 to 20 years really is irrelevant in this argument as were are discussing current performance.
Originally posted by Esoteric Go back for the last 20 years and tell me how many English clubs have won the UEFA Cup and Champions League.
EDIT: Going back 15 years (champions league. Am working on the UEFA cup).
English Winners
Liverpool - 2005
Man U - 1999
Total - 2
English Runner Up
Arsenal - 2006
Total - 1
Italian Winners
AC Milan - 1990, 1994, 2003
Juve ...[text shortened]... have only had 3 finals appearances in the last 15 years, while Spain had 8 and the Italians 11.
I definitely would agree that Italian teams showed dominance during the 90's. However that was 7+ years ago, and your figures show no such dominance this decade, with a possible favour towards English teams over Italians. Note I'm not debating Spanish teams - I've already admitted their league is more competitive.
Liverpool was banned for 6 years after 1985, other English clubs for 5 years. Seeing as your figures are only back to 1991 this doesn't include the time English clubs were banned, but the 5 years of no European football did have a huge affect on the competitiveness of English clubs on the European stage.
Originally posted by stevetodd well you cannot argue with current performance, that's 3 english teams (I think it's safe to assume liverpool will make it) in the semi finals
Originally posted by ElleEffSeee I definitely would agree that Italian teams showed dominance during the 90's. However that was 7+ years ago, and your figures show no such dominance this decade, with a possible favour towards English teams over Italians. Note I'm not debating Spanish teams - I've already admitted their league is more competitive.
Liverpool was banned for 6 years afte ...[text shortened]... otball did have a huge affect on the competitiveness of English clubs on the European stage.
Originally posted by Esoteric Yep. Seems that way. I guess it comes down to personal taste.
well no, not really, it comes down to facts, we're not talking about whether you like a particular food here, we're talking about facts between the epl and the italian league, the facts are the epl is better - simple as
Originally posted by eatmybishop well no, not really, it comes down to facts, we're not talking about whether you like a particular food here, we're talking about facts between the epl and the italian league, the facts are the epl is better - simple as
What facts? You have no facts to prove this? If you think purely basing a leagues merit on the champions league result is the final measuring stick then that is ridiculous. In the last ten champions league:
English Teams have won it twice, and runners up once. Italian teams have won it twice, and runners up 3 times.
So if you want to go by that (which I disagree with using this as a measuring stick) then the Italians have a slight advantage.
It's all about the money. The English league has got stronger over the last decade or so as it has got immeasurably richer; it's now clearly superior to Serie A (which is in a bit of a mess), and I would suggest about on a par with La Liga. With a very small number of exceptions (in South America), money will always win in the end these days. Improved scouting and players' willingness to travel anywhere in the world (for a price) make that inevitable.
is the premiership now the greatest?
11 Apr '07 12:23
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