Originally posted by @wolfe63 Now, if the question is: "Would I advocate that MY WIFE have an abortion"...that's a different matter altogether.
The problem with Evangelicalism is, it has a great propensity to foist its beliefs upon everyone else as an absolute truth. Thus preempting the truly mysterious Will of God.
And I do not believe for a second, that Evangelicals, have an esoteric knowledge of that.
You did not answer the question.
The question is, do you agree with the official position of the Catholic church that abortion is murder?
Now if you sit back and say that murder may be part of the "mysterious:" will of God, then so be it.
Originally posted by @kquinn909 Didn't address my question. I accidently kill a unborn child I get charged w/ murder. But the women intentionally kills it it's ok. And what about my rights if I'm the father of said child? I have no say in the KILLING of my child?
Once again proper education would circumvent this problem of yours.
BTW I thought you couldn't kill something as yet unborn.
It could be argued that the foetus is part of the mother until birth . Either way it should remain the womans right to decide. If they (women)collectively pass a law giving men authority to terminate their pregnancy then you can 'kill the child '. Until then the mother should have full control over this decision
Originally posted by @whodey You did not answer the question.
The question is, do you agree with the official position of the Catholic church that abortion is murder?
Now if you sit back and say that murder may be part of the "mysterious:" will of God, then so be it.
You seem to believe that the convenient shelter of demanding answers to personal questions will obscure the illogical nature of your public argument.
State your rationale...and I'll state mine: That's a good place to build a platform for debate.
Instead, in these forums, you propose an overabundance of warped and ridiculous argument, desperately seeking that it be legitimized by the opposition.
Have an answer to your own stupid personal questions first. Then maybe, just maybe, I'll choose to respond in more personal detail afterward.
Originally posted by @kquinn909 So it's ok to abort but if you hurt a woman who's with child and the fetus dies you get charged w/murder. I'm confused.
Should women who have an abortion be charged with murder IYO?
Originally posted by @kquinn909 So it's ok to abort but if you hurt a woman who's with child and the fetus dies you get charged w/murder. I'm confused.
It should definitely be a crime to assault a woman, pregnant or not, and if you want to make it a higher level assault if the fetus dies, that's fine with me. But I agree completely that charging a person with murder for killing a fetus contradicts the position that abortion should be a woman's choice.
Originally posted by @sh76 It should definitely be a crime to assault a woman, pregnant or not, and if you want to make it a higher level assault if the fetus dies, that's fine with me. But I agree completely that charging a person with murder for killing a fetus contradicts the position that abortion should be a woman's choice.
The real issue is how should we view an attack that does not injure the pregnant woman but kills the fetus. To me this is clearly a major crime even if you feel there are consistency issues. Am I right to assume you feel the same way?
Originally posted by @kquinn909 Didn't address my question. I accidently kill a unborn child I get charged w/ murder. But the women intentionally kills it it's ok. And what about my rights if I'm the father of said child? I have no say in the KILLING of my child?
Abortions take place usually within three or four months of conception. Most cases court case I've seen with an unborn being killed involved women much further along in their pregnancy, when abortion is already illegal.
Can you provide a case where murder was charged for an unborn during the legal abortion window?
Originally posted by @suzianne Smack a woman around and you actually get charged with assault.
What's the world coming to?
I think the question was, why is it murder to kill an unborn baby, only in the case that the Mother wants the baby. Essentially the Mother assigns value to a baby's life. Pretty reasonable question concerning the law.
Originally posted by @kquinn909 Didn't address my question. I accidently kill a unborn child I get charged w/ murder. But the women intentionally kills it it's ok. And what about my rights if I'm the father of said child? I have no say in the KILLING of my child?
Nope.
Her body. Her choice.
Until the little parasite is born, it’s part of her. If she commits suicide, it goes with her. She can do to herself what she pleases. Like you can to yourself. You can’t do what you like to someone else.
No. The faetus isn’t someone else. It’s part of the woman’s body.
Oh yes, life is very unfair. Mother nature’s a bitch.
And 1 in 7 children aren’t from the man who thinks it is.
Originally posted by @quackquack The real issue is how should we view an attack that does not injure the pregnant woman but kills the fetus. To me this is clearly a major crime even if you feel there are consistency issues. Am I right to assume you feel the same way?
Major crime, sure. I'd call it serious bodily injury, which makes it Aggravated Assault and a Class B felony in most states, sometimes punishable by 10-15 years in prison or more. Killing the fetus is absolutely seriously harming the mother since it's in her body.
But to call it homicide (or especially murder) is inconsistent with allowing abortion under any circumstances. Even post-viability, the Supreme Court has said that states must allow abortions to protect the life or health of the mother. I can't reconcile even that position with charging someone with homicide for killing the fetus.
Originally posted by @shavixmir No. I don’t agree with any doctrine based on stories whoch are thoisands of years old about gods, fairies dwarves.
The question was addressed to someone who said that they were a Catholic, not you.
I realize what you think of the Bible, and I'm equally sure that as much as you try to construe this issue as being only one of religion vs. secularism, it is not. This issue is also one of science and our humanity. I realize you think humans become humans only after the Birth Fairy waves her wand over the fetus as it exists the womb, so why not believe in the Bible as well?
Originally posted by @whodey The question was addressed to someone who said that they were a Catholic, not you.
I realize what you think of the Bible, and I'm equally sure that as much as you try to construe this issue as being only one of religion vs. secularism, it is not. This issue is also one of science and our humanity. I realize you think humans become humans only after the ...[text shortened]... ry waves her wand over the fetus as it exists the womb, so why not believe in the Bible as well?
Nope. Her body her choice.
Accept it. Nothing about humanity or gods. It’s her body and whilst the faetus is in her, it’s part of her body and she can do with it what she wants.
You just go back to supporting kids being locked in cages and never mention humanity again, thank you very much.
Abortion/murder
29 Jun '18 12:501 edit
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