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@AThousandYoung saidTWIST:
TWIST The apple tree originally belonged to the Jew but it was taken by violence
Jew: "1877 years ago (1947-70), an Italian took this apple tree from my 75th great grandfather. So give me the tree."
Arab: "No, this tree is only 100 years old and was planted by my great-grandfather."
Jew: "But he planted it on my land."
Arab: "This is not your land. Since the Middle Ages you have lived in Poland! You have a whole orchard in Poland. Why are you hassling me?"
Jew: "The Germans burned my orchard."
Arab: "That's sad news. Germans? Italians? I can see you have problems with Europeans, but I've never persecuted you. I've lived her for a long time. Did you think I was just 'keeping your seat warm'?"
Jew: "See this gun? I'm deporting you. Go be homeless in some other country." 😆
@spruce112358 saidIt’s not 1970.
TWIST:
Jew: "1877 years ago (1947-70), an Italian took this apple tree from my 75th great grandfather. So give me the tree."
Arab: "No, this tree is only 100 years old and was planted by my great-grandfather."
Jew: "But he planted it on my land."
Arab: "This is not your land. Since the Middle Ages you have lived in Poland! You have a whole orchard in Poland. Why ar ...[text shortened]... g your seat warm'?"
Jew: "See this gun? I'm deporting you. Go be homeless in some other country." 😆
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@spruce112358 saidOne problem with humans’ view of justice is they interpret the past to fit their predetermined opinions.
The whole problem with humans is that most are fundamentally unable to understand the concept of justice. 😆
I don’t see you talking much about Hawaii. Does this mean your implied “statute of limitations” for such things is about 100 years?
If so, what happens in 25 years? Does justice stop being relevant in the Israel case?
@AThousandYoung saidPuerto Ricans are presently denied their rights. Palestinians are also presently denied their right to political autonomy and/or living in a large concentration camp under foreign control. Hawaiians are not. 😆
One problem with humans’ view of justice is they interpret the past to fit their predetermined opinions.
I don’t see you talking much about Hawaii. Does this mean your implied “statute of limitations” for such things is about 100 years?
If so, what happens in 25 years? Does justice stop being relevant in the Israel case?
So you will find that I talk about Puerto Rico becoming a state and Palestinians gaining their rights. The reason I don't talk about Hawaiians, or Native Americans, or Aboriginal Australians, or Japanese Ainu is that I don't support unwinding history because punishing someone today for actions taken by people in the past (Israel: EXTREMELY REMOTE past) is problematic. That is the point of my OP.
I am VERY interested in justice for people alive today whose rights are being violated by other people alive today. 😆
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@spruce112358 said
Puerto Ricans are presently denied their rights. Palestinians are also presently denied their right to political autonomy and/or living in a large concentration camp under foreign control. Hawaiians are not. 😆
So you will find that I talk about Puerto Rico becoming a state and Palestinians gaining their rights. The reason I don't talk about Hawaiians, or Native Amer ...[text shortened]... ed in justice for people alive today whose rights are being violated by other people alive today. 😆
t I don't support unwinding history because punishing someone today for actions taken by people in the past (Israel: EXTREMELY REMOTE past) is problematic
And yet your OP begins with “once upon a time” and you reference events that happened 75 years ago.
What does “the apple” represent?
@AThousandYoung saidBut which lead to rights violations which are ongoing even today. 😆t I don't support unwinding history because punishing someone today for actions taken by people in the past (Israel: EXTREMELY REMOTE past) is problematic
And yet your OP begins with “once upon a time” and you reference events that happened 75 years ago.
What does “the apple” represent?
Unlike Hawaiians.
@beardmusic saidYou are rambling. Try again. Who or what was imperialistic about the situation in 1947 ? Was it the Jews, the British? Please explain how. I would appreaciate some clear statements.
@Rajk999
I am aware of the practicalities of 1947 and my 'theory' about imperialism fits in to these events as they were an act of imperialism. Surely this is a clear and self-evident historical fact?
As I also mentioned at its core imperialism is about power - those with better weapons etc. can impose their will on those who are weaker than they are. Again this is c ...[text shortened]... ng then they should be resisted wherever they occur not selectively justified on particular grounds.
Bear in mind that from 1915 the British took this area from the Ottoman Empire, and up until 1948 when the British left, the Jews and Arabs were hostile toward each other. There was no Arab government, and both parties owned parcels of land purchased from the Ottoman Empire or the British.
Both Jews and Arabs had claims to the land to different degrees.
If you can, tell me what the British / UN should have done, because clearly you believe they did something wrong.
@spruce112358 saidPalestinians had their own state 1948. They refused this and chose war.
Puerto Ricans are presently denied their rights. Palestinians are also presently denied their right to political autonomy and/or living in a large concentration camp under foreign control. Hawaiians are not. 😆
So you will find that I talk about Puerto Rico becoming a state and Palestinians gaining their rights. The reason I don't talk about Hawaiians, or Native Amer ...[text shortened]... ed in justice for people alive today whose rights are being violated by other people alive today. 😆
They choose to rape and kill Jews.
Serves them F..king right.
They deserve everything they are currently getting.
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@spruce112358 saidAs soon as Israel finishes pacifying and annexing Gaza Arabs in Israel will be just like Hawaiians in the USA and everything will be ok!
But which lead to rights violations which are ongoing even today. 😆
Unlike Hawaiians.
EDIT I'm sure these Hawaiians would dispute your claim that their rights are not being violated:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/dec/22/native-hawaiians-wait-decades-return-colonized-land-state-failure
@AThousandYoung saidExcept as Trump would say, the immigrants in the camps "have to go back where they came from, since immigrants are not welcome." 😆
As soon as Israel finishes pacifying and annexing Gaza Arabs in Israel will be just like Hawaiians in the USA and everything will be ok!
EDIT I'm sure these Hawaiians would dispute your claim that their rights are not being violated:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/dec/22/native-hawaiians-wait-decades-return-colonized-land-state-failure
So all the refugees in Lebanon and Jordan etc. need to go back to Israel.
That should be fun! 😆
@AThousandYoung saidGaza AND the WB can be annexed and all Palestinians can elect representatives to sit in the Knesset. That's perfectly reasonable. It's called the "one-state solution." 😆
As soon as Israel finishes pacifying and annexing Gaza Arabs in Israel will be just like Hawaiians in the USA and everything will be ok!
EDIT I'm sure these Hawaiians would dispute your claim that their rights are not being violated:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/dec/22/native-hawaiians-wait-decades-return-colonized-land-state-failure
That's what the Hawaiians got.
Either the "one-state" or "two-state" solution is acceptable. What is not acceptable is "no solution." 😆
@spruce112358 saidI thought you were being serious about what you believe and then you quote Trump.
Except as Trump would say, the immigrants in the camps "have to go back where they came from, since immigrants are not welcome." 😆
So all the refugees in Lebanon and Jordan etc. need to go back to Israel.
That should be fun! 😆
You're about as intellectually honest as Wajoma or Average Joe.
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@spruce112358 saidSure, once enough Arab Palestinians have been wiped out and enough Jews have been imported so as to maintain Jewish control of the territory.
Gaza AND the WB can be annexed and all Palestinians can elect representatives to sit in the Knesset. That's perfectly reasonable. It's called the "one-state solution." 😆
That's what the Hawaiians got.
Either the "one-state" or "two-state" solution is acceptable. What is not acceptable is "no solution." 😆
EDIT - Since we're using Hawaii as a model...
@AThousandYoung saidWhat's wrong? If liberals AND Trump all agree that, in the case of Palestinian "illegal immigrants", they have to go back to "their country" then it is unanimous. 😆
I thought you were being serious about what you believe and then you quote Trump.
You're about as intellectually honest as Wajoma or Average Joe.
I don't see a problem. Make it so.