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Debates Forum

  1. 15 Feb '15 17:48
    http://www.westernjournalism.com/watch-cnn-anchor-just-declared-declaration-independence-wrong-god/#lxsRM76eRyOwFEeB.97

    Progressives have already dismantled the Constitution, now their focus is the Declaration of Independence.

    So if our natural rights don't come from God, then they must come from man. And if they come from man, then man can take whatever rights those in power see fit.

    Have I got this straight Progressives?
  2. Standard member Seitse
    Doug Stanhope
    15 Feb '15 17:49
    Which country are we talking about?
  3. 15 Feb '15 18:01
    Originally posted by Seitse
    Which country are we talking about?
    The Peoples Repulbic of the Disunited States.
  4. Standard member Quarl
    Quarl
    15 Feb '15 18:50
    Originally posted by Seitse
    Which country are we talking about?
    Comoros
  5. Standard member bill718
    Enigma
    16 Feb '15 04:51 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by whodey
    http://www.westernjournalism.com/watch-cnn-anchor-just-declared-declaration-independence-wrong-god/#lxsRM76eRyOwFEeB.97

    Progressives have already dismantled the Constitution, now their focus is the Declaration of Independence.

    So if our natural rights don't come from God, then they must come from man. And if they come from man, then man can take whatever rights those in power see fit.

    Have I got this straight Progressives?
    No Whodey...as usual, you DON"T have it straight. Just because a few people believe this about God, does not make it so. No one has "dismantled" the Constitution, and the Declaration of Independence will be alive and well long after you and I are gone and forgotten. Why don't you go and play in the freeway or something...
  6. 16 Feb '15 05:25
    Originally posted by bill718
    No Whodey...as usual, you DON"T have it straight. Just because a few people believe this about God, does not make it so. No one has "dismantled" the Constitution, and the Declaration of Independence will be alive and well long after you and I are gone and forgotten. Why don't you go and play in the freeway or something...
    So do you believe that our rights come from God or from man?
  7. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    16 Feb '15 05:51 / 1 edit
    "The strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must."

    Thucydides
  8. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    16 Feb '15 06:40
    Originally posted by whodey
    So do you believe that our rights come from God or from man?
    Right wingers on this site never cease to amaze; they have been almost unanimous in ridiculing the philosophy of Natural Rights yet now seek to use someone's questioning whether God provided them as fodder against "progressives" (whatever that means in WhodeySpeak).

    Of course, the answer to that question is not "either/or"; Natural Rights come from Man's Nature (hence the "Natural" part) - one can reach the conclusion that humans have Natural Rights with a Creator God or without one.
  9. 16 Feb '15 12:01 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    Right wingers on this site never cease to amaze; they have been almost unanimous in ridiculing the philosophy of Natural Rights yet now seek to use someone's questioning whether God provided them as fodder against "progressives" (whatever that means in WhodeySpeak).

    Of course, the answer to that question is not "either/or"; Natural Rights come from Ma ...[text shortened]... one can reach the conclusion that humans have Natural Rights with a Creator God or without one.
    When have I made fun of natural rights? I've made fun of positive rights. Positive rights are what government must buy you or money they must secure for you for any myriad of reasons. In other words, I'm not in favor of empowering government to "help" me. Government, who is in the back pocket of corporate America, is who needs to be restrained, not empowered further. Thanks to people like yourself, that is why corporate America now sets our mandated health care tax rates.

    Negative rights are what I identify as a natural right, such as the freedom to bear arms. Notice, government is not mandated to go out and buy me a gun, rather, government is simply restricted from taking arms that I may obtain.

    As for the "nature" of man, who determines this? It seems to me Progressives are forever redefining commonly held beliefs about what our nature is exactly. The goal posts keep moving, just like Cuomo in the video is telling people that Jefferson did not really mean God when he used the term God.
  10. 16 Feb '15 12:02
    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    "The strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must."

    Thucydides
    Might makes right?
  11. 16 Feb '15 12:06 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by whodey
    http://www.westernjournalism.com/watch-cnn-anchor-just-declared-declaration-independence-wrong-god/#lxsRM76eRyOwFEeB.97

    Progressives have already dismantled the Constitution, now their focus is the Declaration of Independence.

    So if our natural rights don't come from God, then they must come from man. And if they come from man, then man can take whatever rights those in power see fit.

    Have I got this straight Progressives?
    "Our rights do not come from God. That’s your faith, that’s my faith, but that’s not our country."

    how about you chill and stop with the tantrums.

    he is right. US was not founded to be a christian nation. these rights are yours regardless of who you believe in and who crated you.
  12. 16 Feb '15 12:11
    Originally posted by whodey
    http://www.westernjournalism.com/watch-cnn-anchor-just-declared-declaration-independence-wrong-god/#lxsRM76eRyOwFEeB.97

    Progressives have already dismantled the Constitution, now their focus is the Declaration of Independence.

    So if our natural rights don't come from God, then they must come from man. And if they come from man, then man can take whatever rights those in power see fit.

    Have I got this straight Progressives?
    "So if our natural rights don't come from God, then they must come from man. And if they come from man, then man can take whatever rights those in power see fit."
    if they do come from god, man had not problem taking them away throughout most of history.

    how about you count how many times the right to freedom, free speech, equality, right to a fair trial, etc were taken away in the bible.


    this is just another instance of someone saying something sensible and you throwing a tantrum. you are not impressing anyone.
  13. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    16 Feb '15 12:43 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by whodey
    When have I made fun of natural rights? I've made fun of positive rights. Positive rights are what government must buy you or money they must secure for you for any myriad of reasons. In other words, I'm not in favor of empowering government to "help" me. Government, who is in the back pocket of corporate America, is who needs to be restrained, not empowe ...[text shortened]... in the video is telling people that Jefferson did not really mean God when he used the term God.
    Yes, the "goal post has moved" from the acceptance of many violations of Natural Rights that you and Judge Moore supported to their disapproval.

    It's highly doubtful you'd approve of what Jefferson thought of as God.http://www.monticello.org/site/research-and-collections/jeffersons-religious-beliefs

    Christian Fundamentalists like you and Judge Moore certainly shouldn't cite Jefferson in support of imposing their religious views to limit Natural Rights. In fact, they often criticize him for saying there should be a "wall of separation between Church and State".
  14. 16 Feb '15 18:22
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    Yes, the "goal post has moved" from the acceptance of many violations of Natural Rights that you and Judge Moore supported to their disapproval.

    It's highly doubtful you'd approve of what Jefferson thought of as God.http://www.monticello.org/site/research-and-collections/jeffersons-religious-beliefs

    Christian Fundamentalists like you and Judge Moor ...[text shortened]... often criticize him for saying there should be a "wall of separation between Church and State".
    Jefferson's personal views have little or no bearing on actual government documents.
  15. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    16 Feb '15 18:36
    Originally posted by normbenign
    Jefferson's personal views have little or no bearing on actual government documents.
    Bitch at whodey; he was the one who mentioned Jefferson and what he supposedly meant when he mentioned God in the DOI (more precisely he mentioned "Nature's God" and the "Creator".