Governments... Legal vs Moral

@shavixmir said
It’s illegal to discriminate against any form of consenual adult sexual relationship.
So if you’re educating on relationships, then you educate on the full spectrum of it.

The new law bans films with homosexual content. That is discrimination.

What you see on film is an actual adult relationship? I thought it was entertainment.

@eladar said
Should governments try to claim that something is moral? Or should governments simply claim it is legal?

Case in point, sexual relationships

Should a government actively claim that one kind of sexual relationship is moral, make claims that there is nothing wrong with it?

For instance, two people living together without getting married. Should governments take steps ...[text shortened]... ertain worldview, aka religious view.

Not that the liberals around here will agree with that lol.

If you take your 3 scenarios and replace "nothing wrong" with "something wrong", you would end up with exactly the same debate.

But that wouldn't work for you, would it ?

@eladar said
@shavixmir
When it comes to homosexuality, the morality basis is that the government has no right being in bedrooms.

No amount of argument on your part can make homosexuality moral, all you can do is explain why you believe it is moral. Having said that, nobody can claim absolute morality on this issue, at least which everyone will agree. All we can do is give our own opinion.

Other than morality, what would be the basis for creating laws which give homosexuals equal rights?

@eladar said
The story that inspired me to start the thread

EU chief Ursula von der Leyen slammed as a disgrace the law passed by Viktor Orban's government banning the "promotion" of homosexuality to minors, while Germany's foreign minister said UEFA's decision sent the "wrong signal".

https://sports.yahoo.com/germany-turns-rainbow-coloured-protest-095711805.html


Refusing to use the government to display a pro-homosexuality symbol is anti-homosexuality? Homey don't think so.

**In my Libertarian Opinion**...

The government should never pass laws that control societal norms. In your above case, governments control schools
so they do have the authority
to control behavior of teachers and students, providing the people approve.

I admit this is a very loose answer to a complex issue but that is how I would respond in the onset.

@eladar said
It even happened in Oklahoma

https://www.wpr.org/evers-orders-gay-pride-flag-fly-over-state-capitol

Wisconsin

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/politics/2021/06/01/lgbtq-pride-flag-raised-over-wisconsin-state-capitol-third-year/7488769002/

Secretary of State Antony J. Blinken has authorized U.S. diplomatic missions across the world to fly the rainbow pride flag on the same pole as the American flag at embassies and consulates, according to a State Department cable reviewed by The New York Times.
-------------------

Uh huh...

What it says to the naïve observer is "We are American and Queer".

@shavixmir said
I think the moral vs illegal is an interesting topic.
However, this example has nothing to do with actual morality, but to do with human rights and EU law.

Hungary’s new law contradicts EU law on equal rights, etc.
Hence the uproar about it.

It never should be the case that a *special* lobby group has the right to force their idiom down
innocent childrens' throats. That's the point. Prevent indoctrination on behalf of 5% of the people or any other group.

@mghrn55 said
If you take your 3 scenarios and replace "nothing wrong" with "something wrong", you would end up with exactly the same debate.

But that wouldn't work for you, would it ?

Good point.

On one hand, a small group of people get to promote their ideas of anything (in this case, sexual expression)
and people think this is either good or bad. And when the anti-group gets to say that a certain idea
is bad for people, the other side takes umbrage. Let's be objective.
No tiny minority should have the RIGHT to force their belief system on innocent people. School children will
always learn in chit-chat what homosexuality is about and they can decide for themselves.

But watch groups fight this like banshees.

@shavixmir said
Other than morality, what would be the basis for creating laws which give homosexuals equal rights?

Homosexuals, a tiny fragment of society already have the right (and should, IMO) to have non-violent sex
with like minded people. But these people want to **indoctrinate** children with their moral view on their sexual choice.
Whaaaa... all of a sudden the parents of said children have no choice to form *their* opinion on sex?
These people that want to force their OPINIONS on deviant sexual behavior are nazis, IMO, and should be stopped.

Children in school are a captive audience (literally) and the nazis know this.

@earl-of-trumps said
Homosexuals, a tiny fragment of society already have the right (and should, IMO) to have non-violent sex
with like minded people. But these people want to **indoctrinate** children with their moral view on their sexual choice.

Whaaaa... all of a sudden the parents of said children have no choice to form *their* opinion on sex?
These people that want to force their OPINIONS on deviant sexual behavior are nazis, IMO, and should be stopped.

You think homosexuals are shoving their sexuality down your throat?

When you teach history, don’t you think it’s good to explain context from various points of view?
Surely when it comes to sex education, explaining the different choices and lifestyles and mechanisms is just as important?

And banning movies with homosexual content isn’t stopping indoctrination, it’s banning a minority within the context of art.

@eladar said
The pracitce of any sort of sexuality is a choice.

If you deny that, then there is not use in trying to discuss things. You are simply a true believer without reason for your beliefs.

And as usual you are as thick as mud and twice as nasty.
So you are just choosing to be straight? I think you must be bi-curious in that case.

@earl-of-trumps said
Homosexuals, a tiny fragment of society already have the right (and should, IMO) to have non-violent sex
with like minded people. But these people want to **indoctrinate** children with their moral view on their sexual choice.
Whaaaa... all of a sudden the parents of said children have no choice to form *their* opinion on sex?
These people that want to force their ...[text shortened]... should be stopped.

Children in school are a captive audience (literally) and the nazis know this.

“ Children in school are a captive audience (literally) and the nazis know this.”

The homophobic Christian evangelical nazis have known this for a very long time.
Their reign of terror is coming to an end in the civilised world. 🏳️‍🌈🥳

@shavixmir said
Other than morality, what would be the basis for creating laws which give homosexuals equal rights?

The government has no right being in bedrooms. It is a limit of what government can do that makes homosexuality legal.

@kevcvs57 said
And as usual you are as thick as mud and twice as nasty.
So you are just choosing to be straight? I think you must be bi-curious in that case.

I guess the idea of being in control of your sexual urges is a bit beyond your comprehension.

@shavixmir said
You think homosexuals are shoving their sexuality down your throat?

When you teach history, don’t you think it’s good to explain context from various points of view?
Surely when it comes to sex education, explaining the different choices and lifestyles and mechanisms is just as important?

And banning movies with homosexual content isn’t stopping indoctrination, it’s banning a minority within the context of art.

You think there needs to be sex eduction beyond if you are going to have sex and you do not want children use protection?

Who to have sex with and when to have sex is a moral issue. I was never taught the kind of stuff in my sex ed in school that you describe. What you describe is neither needed nor useful.

Everytime there is gay flag flown, someone is shoving homosexuality down a person's throat. It is no different than walking around with a Bible and thumping it in people's faces.

@shavixmir said
You think homosexuals are shoving their sexuality down your throat?

When you teach history, don’t you think it’s good to explain context from various points of view?
Surely when it comes to sex education, explaining the different choices and lifestyles and mechanisms is just as important?

And banning movies with homosexual content isn’t stopping indoctrination, it’s banning a minority within the context of art.

Whoa whoa whoa, there.

Making gay movies like Broke Back Mountain, available to the open public as a matter of choice is a far cry
from forcing students to learn and favor a sexual philosophy. Please!!

And as a Libertarian, naturally, I think banning gay movies from bring available to the open public is likewise wrongful.
Everybody should be FREE to choose what they want. Why can't liberal nazis see it that way?