Originally posted by RedmikeWould you put the SSP in with the SWP?
The left in the UK has, for decades, been divided between those who were generally supportive of the USSR and those who were critical.
This can be broken down into the Communist Party of Great Britain (CPGB) and assorted offshoots, and in the other corner, the multiplicity of Trotskyist groups WRP, SWP, People's Front of Judea etc etc. Overly simplistic, ...[text shortened]... litant MPs would be hostile to the USSR, whereas I'm sure some others were more sympathetic.
I quite liked the SWP before they became an Islamic party, led by an utter idiot, Mr George "the cat" Galloway.
I think that he said taht the fall of the USSR was one of the worst things ever to happen, so he would be one of the (few) USSR-symapthetic (ex)-labourites.
The position of the left in England is so awful- it makes me want to move to Scotland or Wales. 😉
Originally posted by petrosianpupilHey, Petro, that was better. You actually mentioned Iran! (golf clap)
You been on the wacky baccy Dan Ace? Changing the subject? I was replying to a point made in the previous post!!!
Blame Bush regardless!!!! Strange I dunno what made me think of Bush when discussing superpowers interferring. That was a strange illogical leap.
I don't mind posting about Iran its the fact that I am worried my views might be agreed ...[text shortened]... try, it's influence and support in the middle east has grown massively.
Happy now ace?
Now, quite a bit of what you say is true. The distrust of the US does exist (kinda like the distrust of the UK & France spawned after WW1, then they carved up the Arabian nations) BUT... We are talking about the freedoms enjoyed by the people of Iran. So, I had a couple questions:
1) How excatly the "massive imbalance in its population age" equate to a lack of freedom to its people.
2) It seems to me that one party state, that is Muslim, which does not foster tolerance of other religions, should not be supported in any way. Where do you stand on that?
Originally posted by petrosianpupilVery few on the left saw Stalin as very bad when he was alive- the 5 years plans looked (and in fact were) very successful. It was only after his death all the nasty stuff about a few minor purges and the such came out.
Thats why I used the past tense!!!!!!
The post I was replying to was about socialists fighting dictators, its a bit late fighting them when they are dead!!!!!! I don't understand how you can think I was talking about todays new labour.
But the mainstream labour party (which I assume is the socialist party you are talking about) never was really that close to Stalin.
I'm sorry, but I can't see the post you referred to.
I probably should have had some idea what it was about before posting, but there you go.
😀
Originally posted by Dace AceWho is supporting Iran?
Hey, Petro, that was better. You actually mentioned Iran! (golf clap)
Now, quite a bit of what you say is true. The distrust of the US does exist (kinda like the distrust of the UK & France spawned after WW1, then they carved up the Arabian nations) BUT... We are talking about the freedoms enjoyed by the people of Iran. So, I had a couple questions ...[text shortened]... tolerance of other religions, should not be supported in any way. Where do you stand on that?
Originally posted by wedgehead2The SWP were, until recently, part of the SSP (long story).
Would you put the SSP in with the SWP?
I quite liked the SWP before they became an Islamic party, led by an utter idiot, Mr George "the cat" Galloway.
I think that he said taht the fall of the USSR was one of the worst things ever to happen, so he would be one of the (few) USSR-symapthetic (ex)-labourites.
The position of the left in England is so awful- it makes me want to move to Scotland or Wales. 😉
The SSP is a collection of lots of different left groups - from elements of the CPGB to Trotskytist groups to people from the left of the labour party to people from peace campaigns etc etc.
So, the SSP doesn't have a view on the former USSR, as we didn't exist at the time.
I know Galloway well - from my labour party days. In his flat in Glasgow there were 2 portraits - Lenin and JFK. I agree about his USSR sympathies.
I think an important point here is that sympathy with the former USSR isn't the same as support for Stalin.
Originally posted by Dace AceThe imbalance of age is very important in Iran. It impacts on voting patterns and more importantly the inevitable clash of views that will happen when this massive young group start to wake up and want more influence and FREEDOM. Generally oldies like structure, youth likes freedom.
Hey, Petro, that was better. You actually mentioned Iran! (golf clap)
Now, quite a bit of what you say is true. The distrust of the US does exist (kinda like the distrust of the UK & France spawned after WW1, then they carved up the Arabian nations) BUT... We are talking about the freedoms enjoyed by the people of Iran. So, I had a couple questions ...[text shortened]... tolerance of other religions, should not be supported in any way. Where do you stand on that?
The last democratic election was largely ignored by many of the young dissillusioned voters, allowing a shift away from the previous almost reasonable parliament. This will not always be the case. For the past few years their has been an explosion in mobile phones and the internet in Iran. The ruling clerics have always controlled the information to their population, this is the key to controlling their freedom they will find it increasingly difficult to maintain their rigid control.
I understand and share your massive reservations about the growing power and influence of the muslim faith, for many reasons.
I am not an absolutist, I am not religious but even the muslim faith has many good points. I would rather we supported the good points. I believe that societies evolve naturally towards freedom. Our problem has always been that we impose democracies on societies that are tribal or religious in their voting habits.
Basically Iran is a country with many problems. Lots of these problems are to do with peoples GENUINELY held beliefs. People do not accept they are wrong easily and never will from someone seen as their enemy. The solutions are slow and painful. They won't be solved through threats.
There was a time when Islam was far more tolerant than christianity and far more sucessful as a result. Unfortunately fear breeds narrow minded entrenchment of views and a tendency to get your retaliation in first, look at the effects of 9/11 on American policy.
We must always be mindful that these countries have people who are innocent victims. Most people are far less responible for their governments actions than democracies.
Originally posted by petrosianpupilWow, that was very good, thank you!
The imbalance of age is very important in Iran. It impacts on voting patterns and more importantly the inevitable clash of views that will happen when this massive young group start to wake up and want more influence and FREEDOM. Generally oldies like structure, youth likes freedom.
The last democratic election was largely ignored by many of the yo ...[text shortened]... t victims. Most people are far less responible for their governments actions than democracies.
I don't know about this whole Iran is good or bad thing, but I know the Stennis just picked up an airwing and headed for the gulf at "full speed. no stops"
It should take about 30 days or so to get there and that's perfect timing, cuz after the SuperBowl there really is nothing to watch on T.V. I might have to get a big screen. Maybe they'll broadcast in HD.
Originally posted by MerkMerk, are you a squid?
I don't know about this whole Iran is good or bad thing, but I know the Stennis just picked up an airwing and headed for the gulf at "full speed. no stops"
It should take about 30 days or so to get there and that's perfect timing, cuz after the SuperBowl there really is nothing to watch on T.V. I might have to get a big screen. Maybe they'll broadcast in HD.
Originally posted by jammerWhat did you expect from a bunch of 12 year old chesstards?
"Rational Debate?"
Not likely.
What you'll find here are the proponents of Critical Theory trolling America.
No answers.
No solutions proposed.
No debate .. just the search for something .. anything, to criticise.
It's a lot of things .. Political Correctness or Cultural Marxism with Critical Theory as the weapon of choice .. but it's not debate.
Wrong Forum, wrong mix of people
Or in Pinkmikes case, just a half step away from the pine box and wondering what went wrong with your life's philosophy.