@earl-of-trumps saidNo they get mobile phones that track their location and online habits 24/7.
I wonder if slaves in Chinese factories wear ankle bracelets.
@kmax87 saidHateful white racist trolls show their perpetual fanatical intolerance of historical facts
No they get mobile phones that track their location and online habits 24/7.
showing any white people as less than the morally superior beings that their cherished
racist propaganda loves to boast that they are.
The post that was quoted here has been removedThere’s a film on Amazon Prime (brand new) called “De Oost”.
Translated: “The East”.
It’s about the Dutch army’s intervention in Indonesia in 1946.
The film’s okay at best. It reminded my slightly of Apocalypse Now, for some reason.
It shows some of the attrocities committed by the Dutch army.
It touches on some of the dynamics at play. Various Indonesian groups opposing each other, the Moslim violence against Christians, young Dutch soldiers still traumatized by WW2, etc.
Naturally the argument, then, used to use the army (keep the peace) is mentioned. But they clearly show the violence and executions without trial.
Subtely, the best scene by far is the diplomatic / rich land owners party two of the soldiers attend. It’s there, without words, that “keep the peace” becomes clear: “protect the profit margins of the rich Dutch people.”
An amusing detail, that I’d never heard of, was the Dutch soldiers being booed when they returned home from duty.
Like Vietnam soldiers returning home.
Just goes to show that one can’t quite claim that “The Dutch” think all the same on the matter.
Another interesting fact about the Dutch and slavery: Northern African slave traders would sail to Scandinavia and Iceland to get white slaves to sell in Africa and the Middle-East. They often had Dutch captains, because of their expertise in sailing.
The post that was quoted here has been removedYou claim that most Dutch evidently are proud of their imperialist, colonial past.
“Most” is far off the mark.
“Pride” isn’t really the description.
If anything, “most” Dutch people don’t connect slavery and colonization with their current, every day lives.
“Most” Dutch people don’t live in expensive “Herenhuizen” along the canals of Amsterdam and Delft.
WW2 had a deep impact in Dutch society, the whole of the society, with very deep divisions into who was on which side and the ability to trust neighbours, etc.
The whole political landscape changed. Politics in the Netherlands was divided into 3 columns. And that was basically swept aside.
Slavery (more than 150 years ago) is a remnant of other times. There’s no connection between lives now and then. And most Dutch people, even then, didn’t have slaves and couldn’t afford the riches it brought.
As for Indonesia. Only a small part of Dutch society really had anything to do with it.
Extremely rich land owners, shipping companies and to some extent soldiers.
The impact on Dutch society as a whole was minimal.
There was obviously the Molukken affair in the 70’s with trains being hijacked, etc. But you’re talking about a very small group of people with little bearing on normal every day life.
So, if you ask “most” Dutch people what they think about it, you’ll roughly get these answers:
- The Dutch had a great fleet and we did very good international trade.
- Slavery is evil
- Imperialism is evil
- The Dutch should not have been killing people in Indonesia
It’s a mixed bag of emotions and sentiments.
As for imperialsm being racist? I consider some of the techniques used as racist, but generally speaking, profit was what was wanted and any means to increase profit was deemed acceptable. Of course some imperialists are racist. Others couldn’t care less. Factory workers in Liverpool and Glasgow weren’t treated any better than “native workers” in Indonesia or India.
I don’t think race was the issue.
And yes, there is an extreme right-wing fraction as well which states that bringing up the past, is deliberately attacking Dutch culture now and that these “foreign” elements should be sent back to from whence they came.
All countries have them.
The post that was quoted here has been removedI seriously question those statistics.
Sorry.
I know the research you’re referring to. It polled 1002 Dutch people.
The major problem is: what exactly are they proud of?
If you ask 1002 Dutch people if they’re proud of the attrocities committed during their colonnial past, the answer will be completely different.
If “colonnial past” includes granddad going to Indonesia to train local doctors... the answer makes yet another U-turn.
If you ask 1002 Dutch people if colonization is acceptable, a vast majority will also say no.
So, the research paper you’re referring to is rubbish.
@shavixmir saidyou actually listen to that racist baboon? Good lord, man.
Where exactly am I apologising for Dutch imperialism and racism?
Ask it why it doesn't want to examine slavery going on RIGHT NOW in China.
“Modern-Day Slavery”: China Is Forcing Muslims into Forced Labor, Prison & Indoctrination Camps
We look at the systematic oppression of Muslim minorities in China, from labor programs pushing Uyghurs and Kazakhs into low-wage work in Chinese factories to the indoctrination camps where at least 1 million adults from the Uyghur community are being imprisoned. In Part 2 of our discussion, we speak with Austin Ramzy, New York Times reporter who co-authored a recent exposé headlined “Inside China’s Push to Turn Muslim Minorities into an Army of Workers,” and Nury Turkel, a Uyghur-American attorney and board chair at the Uyghur Human Rights Project.
https://www.democracynow.org/2020/1/9/inside_chinas_push_to_turn_muslim