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Originally posted by Vargyes. a case in point is from the 'Intelegent Design' camp. They came up with a mathamatical argument that said that the number of random mutations needed to DNA to get you from amebas to humans (and every other life form) multiplyed by the probability of having all those mutations happen in that order (or something simmilar I can look it up if you are interested) meant that the chance of life as we know it is so unlikely it is pretty much statistically impossible for it to happen in even the time big bang theory says we have had, and therefore somebody must have either helped the process along or designed everything from scratch. at first glance (especially the way they put it) it looks convincing, but it's a complete fallacy. A good analagy is coin tossing. if you toss a coin tenthousand times you get a sequence of heads and tails. the probability of getting this sequence is 1/(2^10000) which is very small. if you attempted the same feat twice a day every day since the big bang till the present you would not expect to see this sequence again. however you still got it. the fallacy is that while any one result is unbaleivably improbable, every time you roll the dice toss the coin or watch a life bearing planet evolve you will get a result. if you went back 6 billion years and ran the entire evolutionary prosess again you would not get the same result. of course the probability of any one paticular outcome is stupidly small. that doesn't mean that the one we landed up with (were 'created' by) is impossible. most mathmatical arguments of brought up in these cases suffer from the same problem (excluding those which just make stuff up as they go along). they ask the wrong question. which is why asking the right question is almost as important if not more so, than the answer.
If it helps, I read something similar.
It used some world statistics to look at the number of jews in Europe before and after the war.
A lot of these things are pretty convincing at first, like most conspiracy theory stuff, or they wouldn't get any recognition at all. Usually they fall down under closer examination, though.
ps: anybody wanting to talk about this math thing, ID or evolution further please cut and past this into an evolution debate of your choice or PM me and I will do so. I don't want to push this dabate off topic and there are enough 'E' debates to satisfy anybody allready. thanks
Originally posted by googlefudgeI don't want to get into a "Spirituality" style debate, but what do they reckon the chances are of an omnipotent super-being spontaneously popping into existance then using it's super powers to create the universe and all the life in it?
the chance of life as we know it is so unlikely it is pretty much statistically impossible for it to happen in even the time big bang theory says we have had
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this is one of the many reasons I don't beleive in any religeon.
Edit: you solve the problem of where the universe comes from by invoking a creator. but how do you explain the creator. I like the man who carries the universe in his bag, which in tern contains him, and his bag... it's turtles all the way down folks.
Originally posted by DelmerThe soviet's lost that number IN COMBAT and ANOTHER 20 million at the hands of Stalin. Lest not we forget.
The "Second World War" by Martin Gilbert estimates that six million Chinese were killed in WWII between 1937 and 1945. The Soviet Union suffered the most deaths, 20 to 27 million. Japan: 3 million. Germany: 7 million.
No one will ever know for sure and other historians state different figures but all I've ever read are reasonably close to Gilbert's stats.
"The claim that 5,7 million Jews were murdered, is not true. The number of Jewish victims can only range between 1 and 1,5 million, because there were not more Jews within Hitler's reach." --Ferdinand Otto Miksche, The End of The Present, (Das Ende der Gegenwart) Herbig, Munich 1990, page 107
Originally posted by Peachyhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Did_Six_Million_Really_Die%3F
I read an article sometime ago somewhere by some guy (yes I know, am terribly helpful) and how he mathematically proved that if the holocaust has happened, it wouldn't have been to the scale the Jews state, i.e. the 6Million victims.
He worked it out by population verses country and came to the conclusion that if 6Million ready died, and many millions didn ...[text shortened]... ctims are now the oppressors.
Doesn't history have a cruel and twisted sense of humour?
That's what you're thinking of. It's utter crap as you can see from the wikipedia page.
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Originally posted by XanthosNZI think the Illuminati may have a part in this one....
It's a Zionist Conspiracy of the highest order!
Some people in this thread don't seem very bright, so here's a definition of the word "Zionism"! Yay!
Main Entry: Zi·on·ism
Pronunciation: 'zI-&-"ni-z&m
Function: noun
: an international movement orig. for the establishment of a Jewish national or religious community in Palestine and later for the support of modern Israel
Originally posted by googlefudgeI was going to fix some of the spelling errors in here after seeing "Intelegent", but there are WAY TOO MANY. Any point that you might have been trying to prove has been totally ruined because you lack the ability to spell.
yes. a case in point is from the 'Intelegent Design' camp. They came up with a mathamatical argument that said that the number of random mutations needed to DNA to get you from amebas to humans (and every other life form) multiplyed by the probability of having all those mutations happen in that order (or something simmilar I can look it up if you are in ...[text shortened]... s dabate off topic and there are enough 'E' debates to satisfy anybody allready. thanks
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Originally posted by harrymccourtThread 18152
Well it must be true, if THEY say so. We should ask George Lucas for further evidence. Now enough, start a different topic or bring up an old one if you want to discuss this