the Trump show

No not married. They are two 35 yr old guys, met in the Uber going to that apt bldg, agreed to split cost of an apartment. If one goes out and makes more than the other, is there some reason that he should share his salary. A person of liberal schooling cannot bring themselves to answer this question.
Here’s a good one. How many immigrants should we let in each year? What should be the requirements for entry? Killer question.

@averagejoe1 said
No not married. They are two 35 yr old guys, met in the Uber going to that apt bldg, agreed to split cost of an apartment. If one goes out and makes more than the other, is there some reason that he should share his salary. A person of liberal schooling cannot bring themselves to answer this question.
Here’s a good one. How many immigrants should we let in each year? What should be the requirements for entry? Killer question.

They agreed to split the cost of an apartment in your hypothetical, so what is there left to discuss?

I guess your parable is meant to somehow relate to tax policy. Do you support a flat amount taxation policy where everyone pays the same amount of taxes annually regardless of income?

Absolutely. Makes the most sense, but CPA lobbyists, IRS etc won’t let it happen.
But anyway, if each of us gives landlord 1/2 rent each, and go on our way each day, I’m asking if someone who works harder than someone else should give part of his earnings to a person who does not work hard. A liberal has to say yes to this, because to say no defeats all other liberal arguments of economics. But how does he justify his position? It is so curious to me. Philosophically, does a person incur a debt to another person at his moment of birth?

@averagejoe1 said
Absolutely. Makes the most sense, but CPA lobbyists, IRS etc won’t let it happen.
But anyway, if each of us gives landlord 1/2 rent each, and go on our way each day, I’m asking if someone who works harder than someone else should give part of his earnings to a person who does not work hard. A liberal has to say yes to this, because to say no defeats all other liberal ...[text shortened]... curious to me. Philosophically, does a person incur a debt to another person at his moment of birth?

Interesting. So under your proposed system, a disabled person for instance who cannot work will start racking up huge debts due to an inability to pay the required taxes. What do you suggest the government should do to collect these taxes?

@averagejoe1 said
Absolutely. Makes the most sense, but CPA lobbyists, IRS etc won’t let it happen.
But anyway, if each of us gives landlord 1/2 rent each, and go on our way each day, I’m asking if someone who works harder than someone else should give part of his earnings to a person who does not work hard. A liberal has to say yes to this, because to say no defeats all other liberal ...[text shortened]... curious to me. Philosophically, does a person incur a debt to another person at his moment of birth?

Nonsense. The guy making more money is not profiting from the guy with less in your example. In reality the rich do profit from the poor.

This best most charitable generous country in the world has disabled persons covered. Programs everywhere.That is a total different issue (see plethora of ‘issues avoided’ above).
Obviously I refer to people who work hard susidizing those who don’t , or won’t. If 500 people live on an island and one guy collects and saves coconuts all day while another plays guitar on the beach (choices are key here) , does the guitar player have any rights to any of the coconuts in the gatherer’s hut?

@averagejoe1 said
Philosophically, does a person incur a debt to another person at his moment of birth?

Yes. Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.

@averagejoe1 said
This best most charitable generous country in the world has disabled persons covered. Programs everywhere.That is a total different issue (see plethora of ‘issues avoided’ above).
Obviously I refer to people who work hard susidizing those who don’t , or won’t. If 500 people live on an island and one guy collects and saves coconuts all day while another plays guitar on th ...[text shortened]... are key here) , does the guitar player have any rights to any of the coconuts in the gatherer’s hut?

So you do not support a flat amount taxation policy where everyone pays the same amount of taxes annually regardless of income? It's not "obvious" at all what you are actually supporting in terms of taxation policy, which is why I am asking about it. Do you want to somehow measure how useful every person's work is, and redistribute income based on this?

@averagejoe1 said
This best most charitable generous country in the world has disabled persons covered. Programs everywhere.That is a total different issue (see plethora of ‘issues avoided’ above).
Obviously I refer to people who work hard susidizing those who don’t , or won’t. If 500 people live on an island and one guy collects and saves coconuts all day while another plays guitar on th ...[text shortened]... are key here) , does the guitar player have any rights to any of the coconuts in the gatherer’s hut?

If there are no coconuts left, and no other food, then yes.

@averagejoe1 said
No not married. They are two 35 yr old guys, met in the Uber going to that apt bldg, agreed to split cost of an apartment. If one goes out and makes more than the other, is there some reason that he should share his salary. A person of liberal schooling cannot bring themselves to answer this question.
Here’s a good one. How many immigrants should we let in each year? What should be the requirements for entry? Killer question.

You didn't need to explain it !!
It was a joke !! A joke, I tell ya !! 😆

You say that ‘the rich do profit from the poor’. I paid our yard man to rake my yard today ...how did i profit from him? He profited from me when I paid him to rake my yard!your comment makes no sense. Help me Rhonda.
As to the flat tax, we are not under that system, so it is not Germaine to this discussion. I do support it, of bourse. But TODAY I am asked to pay, for instance, for the abortion of some person that I don’t even know....I never have gotten that one, to pay for recreational sex of other people. Another way to look at it. Someone makes a bad choice and the government, which is you and me, have to pay for it. Taken to an extreme, if I buy stock tomorrow, and it drops 50%, should the government pay me for my loss, for my having made a bad choice ?

@averagejoe1 said
You say that ‘the rich do profit from the poor’. I paid our yard man to rake my yard today ...how did i profit from him? He profited from me when I paid him to rake my yard!your comment makes no sense. Help me Rhonda.
As to the flat tax, we are not under that system, so it is not Germaine to this discussion. I do support it, of bourse. But TODAY I am asked to pay, ...[text shortened]... orrow, and it drops 50%, should the government pay me for my loss, for my having made a bad choice ?

With a flat tax, the taxation is proportional to income, not a flat amount as you said you supported earlier.

With your Joe and Bill analogy, would you say it is fair that Joe should pay almost three times as much towards the rent (as Joe earned almost three times as much), despite them having agreed to split the rent? Otherwise, I'm not quite getting the morale of the story, I'm afraid.

@averagejoe1 said
You say that ‘the rich do profit from the poor’. I paid our yard man to rake my yard today ...how did i profit from him? He profited from me when I paid him to rake my yard!your comment makes no sense. Help me Rhonda.
As to the flat tax, we are not under that system, so it is not Germaine to this discussion. I do support it, of bourse. But TODAY I am asked to pay, ...[text shortened]... orrow, and it drops 50%, should the government pay me for my loss, for my having made a bad choice ?

What State are you in where are public funds are used to pay for abortions?

Of course, you "profited" by not having to rake the yard yourself. He did not profit unless you paid him more than the job was worth.

Actually the government lets people deduct stock losses from their income so we do "pay" for it by increased taxes or public debt.

As for your other arguments, let's begin at the start and have you answer a basic question:

What is the purpose of a human society?

Thanks for your reasoned reply. The value of the apt is the same to bill as it is to joe. Each has the exact same use of the premises. So it would follow that each pays for 1/2 rent. To reason otherwise would be tantamount to telling a rich guy to pay $40k for a car that a lesser-monied person pays $25k for. So the issue here is not about the apt, it is about 2 people in exactly the same circumstance, one more productive than the other, who might be required by society to distribute some of his hard-earned money to a stranger. DeBlasio, Bernie, the New Jersey socialist and others think everyone should be equal. My questioning here in this thread is to discover how liberals reason. Some people take risks, some do not, some work hard to make a rich life, Some do not. It is all aboutshow more cards some do not everyone is different. There is no way to redistribute wealth and remain a healthy nation.

Actually, google ‘17 States fund abortions.’
As to human society, simply put, each person in a ‘region’ has his own talent, if you will. Carpenter, bricklayer, potato grower, maker of bricks, computer maker, clothes maker, doctor, computer technician and so on. Boat builder. Car maker. Do they not have to all form a society (a community rather than isolation) in order to all make a more complete and fuller life?
What in the world is ‘ he did not profit unless you paid him more than the job is worth’ ? May I here state a real truism..... nobody ever asks a poor man for a job. Thank God for available jobs so families can live. What if each of us cud only rake yards. Man, this has all been going on for 10,000 years. Do you think Bernie is going to now change all of that, how about everybody getting a check from the government help me Rhonda