Your comparisons are ridiculous, no1. It's not about stopping grown men from abusing their own bodies; it's about ridding the league of cheaters whose steroid use gives them an unfair advantage over other players and may also win them a spot or two in the record books along the way.
Originally posted by ark13My position isn't inconsistent at all. Using steroids isn't cheating in my book as it was done for many years within the rules of the game. Moreover, I do not see any qualitative difference between using steroids as a means to increase muscle mass or eating a bunch of steaks every day. Also medical advances have allowed players to compete where their careers were ruined before. I see no reason why this medical improvement should be arbitrarily banned.
The point is that you feelings are inconsistent. You strongly fight cheating in chess, but don't think we should fight a similar situation in baseball.
I drink about five cups of coffee during my OTB tournaments to help keep me awake and alert and eat a pack of Rolaids to settle my stomach. Am I cheating?
Originally posted by no1marauder"Tommy John" surgery and laser surgery are medical procedures used to heal an injured or impaired part of your body.
What difference is that?
Taking steroids does not heal an injured or impaired part of body. It accelerates muscle development in your body and gives you a definite strength advantage over other average players who do not use them. If I could use a hypothetical example, it would be like a player having surgery/taking drugs to give himself super-human eyesight and allow him to hit the ball everytime it's pitched to him. That is cheating.
Originally posted by darvlayIf everybody is allowed to use steroids how can someone have an "unfair advantage"? You're being shrill and emotional, Mary.
Your comparisons are ridiculous, no1. It's not about stopping grown men from abusing their own bodies; it's about ridding the league of cheaters whose steroid use gives them an unfair advantage over other players and may also win them a spot or two in the record books along the way.
Originally posted by no1marauderIt would be fine I guess if it was not damaging. I don't know how much proof their is, but people tend to drop off early after using steroids. Surgury is fine, but if they start doing it to get an advantage I might frown on it... since some(most?) pitchers tend to do great after getting the TJ.
Call it a medical advancement. 30 years ago there wasn't any "Tommy John" surgery and players who had that type of injury had their careers ended. 50 years ago Ryne Duren had to use Coke-bottle glasses to see; now they can do laser surgery and make you see normally. Players today eat better, have better training methods, etc. etc. etc. That's just the way it is; should everybody have to get drunk every night because Babe Ruth did?
Also, look what Sy Young did before all that... he'd pitch every 3 days, and got 40 and 41 or so complete games a couple years. I just can't see telling an MLB player they are done when we have safe ways of dealing with it.
Lazar surgery for the eyes... that also seems pretty safe these days, and if I needed it I WOULDN'T have gotten it until about now... they seem to have made some great leaps with it in the past year or so I've heard. If you had a set of glasses that would make me heal quicker and swing a bat faster I'd take it over steroids for sure... glasses make your vision better just like lazer surgery would.
As for getting drunk and smacking balls around... I swear I'd hit better with a few beers in me. I bowl better, and golf better with the aiming fluid. (I think anyway) Well, anyway... we still know he drank a lot, where steroid users are not talking to the press about it. Everyone knows he drank, so we can all put our private little * Babe's name if we think he did it all juiced up on hotdogs and beer.
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Originally posted by darvlayShould it be against the rules for some players to have high protein diets that enhance their muscle mass? Your comparison with "superhuman eyesight" is ridiculous though I note that players are allowed to wear glasses and contact lens. Are they cheating?
"Tommy John" surgery and laser surgery are medical procedures used to heal an injured or impaired part of your body.
Taking steroids does not heal an injured or impaired part of body. It accelerates muscle development in your body and gives you a definite strength advantage over other average players who do not use them. If I could use a hypothetica ...[text shortened]... -human eyesight and allow him to hit the ball everytime it's pitched to him. That is cheating.
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Originally posted by PhlabibitUnfortunately I said "It's not about stopping grown men from abusing their own bodies" in the height of my shrill emotion.
That is not touche... steroids have long term damaging affects, so smart people won't do them, and get dicked by the guy who's probably going to die at 53 or earlier....
Originally posted by PhlabibitIf somebody wants to take the risk of dying at 53 by using steroids, that's their call. Dale Earnhardt died a lot younger than that, but nobody said we should outlaw NASCAR because it's tooooooo dangerous to the drivers.
That is not touche... steroids have long term damaging affects, so smart people won't do them, and get dicked by the guy who's probably going to die at 53 or earlier....
Originally posted by no1marauderThat depends. Can I retract my previous statement and jump on board with Phlabby's argument?
Should it be against the rules for some players to have high protein diets that enhance their muscle mass? Your comparison with "superhuman eyesight" is ridiculous though I note that players are allowed to wear glasses and contact lens. Are they cheating?
Originally posted by darvlaySure, but tell me why ANY sport should be allowed then that can have long term negative physical effects to the participants. Talked to Muhummad Ali lately? Tossed a frisbie with Daryl Stingley this weekend? How's Tony C's eyesight, Phlab?
That depends. Can I retract my previous statement and jump on board with Phlabby's argument?
Originally posted by no1marauderOk, let's put it this way...
Sure, but tell me why ANY sport should be allowed then that can have long term negative physical effects to the participants. Talked to Muhummad Ali lately? Tossed a frisbie with Daryl Stingley this weekend? How's Tony C's eyesight, Phlab?
Many are willing to box, race cars, play baseball, NFL... etc... and they know the risk of that. Why should they need to compound the risk by taking steroids? There is risk to everything, but adding an extra risk to keep up is stupid. NASCARS improve to save drivers, many made after #3 crashed. Baseball and NFL players get improved and lighter gear... all these things improve the game, where taking a dangerous drug ontop of all the risks isn't something someone should be forced to do.
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