1. SubscriberVery Rusty
    Treat Everyone Equal
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    15 Jan '18 23:302 edits
    Originally posted by @drewnogal
    I don’t know how often these sort of offenders are released or the likelihood that they will reoffend. I would imagine that the forensic professionals involved in their assessment and treatment during their prison sentence would be the ones to advise upon the conditions by which such people are safely managed and supervised in the community.
    A very good chance if their addiction hasn't been corrected they will reoffend. Jail time will not stop the offender from reoffending no matter how long the sentence may be, only curing the problem will help them. They also have to be willing to want to be helped or it will not happen.

    -VR
  2. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    16 Jan '18 01:27
    Originally posted by @divegeester
    No, almost certainly not. But people convicted of drink-driving probably do.

    When you said
    ... but I would bet my life (sic) that if punishments were less severe, crimes would go up ...

    I thought you were talking about all crimes including rape.

    Were you only talking about drink driving?
  3. Joined
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    16 Jan '18 03:413 edits
    Originally posted by @wolfgang59
    When you said
    ... but I would bet my life (sic) that if punishments were less severe, crimes would go up ...

    I thought you were talking about all crimes including rape.

    Were you only talking about drink driving?
    *sigh* I was speaking generally about criminal activity...including but not specifically drink-drink driving, and excluding but not specifically multiple rapists, child sex offenders, serial killers and generally other homogenised crimes of a heinous nature committed by persons of mental disposition mostly closly associated with unrestrained violent or sexual compulsion.
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    16 Jan '18 03:42
    Originally posted by @very-rusty
    A very good chance if their addiction hasn't been corrected they will reoffend. Jail time will not stop the offender from reoffending no matter how long the sentence may be, only curing the problem will help them. They also have to be willing to want to be helped or it will not happen.
    Exactly.
  5. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    16 Jan '18 09:56
    Originally posted by @divegeester
    *sigh* I was speaking generally about criminal activity...including but not specifically drink-drink driving, and excluding but not specifically multiple rapists, child sex offenders, serial killers and generally other homogenised crimes of a heinous nature committed by persons of mental disposition mostly closly associated with unrestrained violent or sexual compulsion.
    Given that the topic was rapists your post was misleading.
    But I'll let you off this one time. ;-)
  6. Gothenburg
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    16 Jan '18 09:591 edit
    We are so concerned about the criminals, we sometimes forget the victims - there is no time limit for their suffering unless they died.
  7. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    16 Jan '18 10:12
    Originally posted by @torunn
    We are so concerned about the criminals, we sometimes forget the victims - there is no time limit for their suffering unless they died.
    We are so concerned about the victims, we sometimes forget the criminals - their life-story made them what they are.
  8. Gothenburg
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    16 Jan '18 10:161 edit
    Originally posted by @wolfgang59
    We are so concerned about the victims, we sometimes forget the criminals - their life-story made them what they are.
    There are always explanations and reasons why people do things, but they don't necessarily justify their deeds.
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    16 Jan '18 10:51
    Originally posted by @wolfgang59
    Given that the topic was rapists your post was misleading.
    But I'll let you off this one time. ;-)
    The thread topic was/is murder, rape, abduction of a child, but digressed into other crimes introduced by other posters and commented upon by more posters; my post was on topic and on point.
  10. Joined
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    16 Jan '18 10:52
    Originally posted by @wolfgang59
    We are so concerned about the victims, we sometimes forget the criminals - their life-story made them what they are.
    Good grief.
  11. SubscriberDrewnogal
    Constant Gardener
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    16 Jan '18 12:42
    Originally posted by @wolfgang59
    We are so concerned about the victims, we sometimes forget the criminals - their life-story made them what they are.
    Major Study: DHF 2940
    Are children who commit violent acts against other children born evil?
    Jo Hill
    i. Jon Venables
    Jon was the second of three children. His elder brother, then three years old, was an unhappy and frustrated baby who, according to his mother, Susan, never stopped crying and was very hard for her to cope with. Furthermore, Jon was still only one year old when his younger sister was born. Susan said that both Jon and his sister were happy babies, though his sister was also later diagnosed with learning difficulties (Sereny, 1995).
    By the time Jon was three, his parents had divorced and it seems likely that he witnessed much marital strife during his formative years (Thomas, 1993). The subsequent years were chaotic for the children (Jackson, 1995), lasting until James Bulger’s murder seven years later. Neil and Susan’s relationship seemed disordered and the joint custody arrangements meant that Jon was shunted from one house to the other, creating an unsettled home life. His childhood has been described as unhappy (Thomas, 1993; Jackson, 1995).
    Jon’s eldest sibling, then aged nine, became prone to throwing violent tantrums, as detailed in his medical records (Morrison, 1997). Jon was a victim of these and would also presumably have witnessed them. Within a year, Jon was also displaying strange and difficult behaviour.
    Susan also had a tendency to physically hit the children, especially if they would not go to sleep at night and Jon often had sleeping problems (Davis, 2004). She would hit them at other times, however, as she describes: ‘I was hitting Jon ... he was crying and both of us, Neil too, were yelling at him. He was on the floor and I still beat on him’ (Sereny, 1995, p.314). She clearly found it difficult to cope and there were two incidents, which were possibly suicide attempts. Despite obvious familial difficulties there was no intervention from any support services (Morrison, 1997).
  12. Joined
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    16 Jan '18 12:562 edits
    Originally posted by @drewnogal
    Major Study: DHF 2940
    Are children who commit violent acts against other children born evil?
    Jo Hill
    i. Jon Venables
    Jon was the second of three children. His elder brother, then three years old, was an unhappy and frustrated baby who, according to his mother, Susan, never stopped crying and was very hard for her to cope with. Furthermore, Jon was s ...[text shortened]... ious familial difficulties there was no intervention from any support services (Morrison, 1997).
    It is not clear from your post (as you have decided not to say) whether or not you are trying to correlate the abusive upbringing of Jon Venables with his crimes as a child, and/or his repeated crimes of holding child sex pornograpy as an adult, for which his lengthy and published period of “rehabilitation” and subsequent release with a completely fresh start and a new identity, appear to have had a deletarious impact on him.

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/nov/23/james-bulger-killer-jon-venables-back-in-jail-after-being-caught-with-abuse-images-again
  13. Subscribersonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    slatington, pa, usa
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    16 Jan '18 13:43
    Originally posted by @divegeester
    I have zero tolerance for crimes such as this and offences should result in LIFE imprisonment, that is life until death. The offender is obviously mentally ill and the likelyhood of him reoffending is high. I would totally support him being locked up forever.

    One (possible) exception: if he signed a consent to have his testicles removed.
    I might point out it wasn't his testicles that attacked the little girl.
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    16 Jan '18 15:13

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  15. Gothenburg
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    16 Jan '18 15:50
    Originally posted by @drewnogal
    Major Study: DHF 2940
    Are children who commit violent acts against other children born evil?
    Jo Hill
    i. Jon Venables
    Jon was the second of three children. His elder brother, then three years old, was an unhappy and frustrated baby who, according to his mother, Susan, never stopped crying and was very hard for her to cope with. Furthermore, Jon was s ...[text shortened]... ious familial difficulties there was no intervention from any support services (Morrison, 1997).
    It's sad reading and no doubt there are many people who commit crimes who were brought up under severe circumstances. If we can't rely on our legal system, then what do we do?
    We have responsibilities, so do criminals.
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