After foolishing falling for the TOS post - thinking it was a reference to The Original Series (star trek speak for the kirk years) - I got into a small discussion with prad regarding TNG.
We thought it might be some fun talking about TNG and its 7 year run.
Of all the Trek series, TNG is my favorite. It is the series, IMHO, most respectful to the Prime Directive and most consciously about social issues and resolutions.
The debate goes back and forth on who is the better Captiain, Kirk or Picard, and I suspect this will continue for some time.
Any comments on which TNG episodes are your favorites? Why?
I list among my favorites :
Yesterdays Enterprise
Measure Of A Man
Best of Both Worlds (I and II)
Darmok
Subjects tackled by TNG include : gender, humanity, kindness, family, etc.
Lets pick one and discuss!
Live Long and Prosper.
IDIC.
turtlex
My favorite character is Data. I have always found interest in his quest to become more human, for contemplation reasons as well as humorous reasons.
Interesting that a robot could have extreme intelligence and be able to think for himself, be concious of self, but his humanity was lacking because he lacked emotions. It is always food for thought for me.
Emotions piss me off and often I find myself wishing we had more control over them. But then we wouldn't be human without them and the way they work, would we?
I am in a wonderful mood today it seems! 🙄
On a lighter note, the comedy relief surrounding Data and his "quest" was excellent, when he tried to tell jokes or that tilt of his head when he couldn't understand something human. Hilarious stuff!
ncrosby🙂
Originally posted by ncrosbyData is a favorite character of mine as well and one of the most well developed on the show. Which is amusing considering he's introduced as an andriod.
My favorite character is Data. I have always found interest in his quest to become more human, for contemplation reasons as well as humorous reasons.
Interesting that a robot could have extreme intelligence and be able to think for hi ...[text shortened]... ldn't understand something human. Hilarious stuff!
ncrosby🙂
Don't worry about not knowing episodes names. I'm sure we can figure out the episode we're refering to.
One of my favorite episodes is "Measure Of A Man" - which is the episode where Picard must hold court to prove that Data is more than an andriod, that he is not just a "tool" aboard the ship, not just a machine - but a necessary crewmember. That he (Data) is in fact sentient. Picard fights to have Data saved from a scientist who wants to dismantle him to learn more about him and then build more Data's. Picard must defend Data against Riker.
Do you recall that episode? It's an outstanding dialog on what makes a person a person.
One example the Picard uses in Data's favor, to prove he is more than a machine, is that Data has saved a small hologram of Tasha Yar, because he misses her.
(and I agree completely on Picard - Picard is my Captain)
Originally posted by ncrosbyMine too! I love his being rational all the time, and it's impossible to offend him. If only he were a she...
My favorite character is Data.
In the course of the series, a couple of flaws have been introduced in his 'being', though. I remember the episode where he completely messes up the expression 'burning the midnight oil'. Someone with his library on the English language should never make that mistake.
On another issue: what rational reasons are there to fight the Borg Collective? The Enterprise wanders around the Universe, charting unknown territories, ocassionally combatting other civilizations. This might go on for a very long time; reinventing the wheel and fighting the same fights over and over again. Let the Borg take over and our knowledge will increase indefinitely, and at some point there's a good chance there will be no more wars.
Is that really such a bad prospect?
Originally posted by StrayJayNot sure about your feelings about the Borg. Their only existance is to greater themselves. We would be absorbed into the collective. That's why they are so dangerous, they take captive, anyone and everyone in order to benefit themselves, the collective.
Mine too! I love his being rational all the time, and it's impossible to offend him. If only he were a she...
In the course of the series, a couple of flaws have been introduced in his 'being', though. I remember the episode where ...[text shortened]... there will be no more wars.
Is that really such a bad prospect?
We'd be absorbed into the collective and become drones.
My favorite episodes of ST:TNG were: "The Sins of the Father","Redemption","Unification","The Best of Both Worlds","All Good Things...". My favorite characters: Picard and Q. Least favorite:Riker(a Kirk wannabe). Picard or Kirk? Picard,hands down! And,just for the record,my favorite episode in TOS was "Wolf in the Fold". Don't bothering arguing,resistance is futile!😉
Originally posted by turtlexYes, we'd all be absorbed into a collective. What's so bad about that, REALLY?
Not sure about your feelings about the Borg. Their only existance is to greater themselves. We would be absorbed into the collective. That's why they are so dangerous, they take captive, anyone and everyone in order to benefit themselves, the collective.
We'd be absorbed into the collective and become drones.
- We're already members of a collective, never truly free, always bound by social rules. Yes, we'd be drones. So what?
- If we were all part of a Great Borg Collective, there would be no more wars. No more futile fights between Star Fleet, the Romulan Empire and the Cardassians... We would never make the same mistakes again. Currently, we explore and forget, and have to go through the whole exploration process again. In a Borg Collective we explore, but never forget. All information is shared by all, and therefore truly free --hey Roger Stallman, there's a Utopia for you!!
Originally posted by StrayJay
Yes, we'd all be absorbed into a collective. What's so bad about that, REALLY?
- We're already members of a collective, never truly free, always bound by social rules. Yes, we'd be drones. So what?
- If we were all part of a Great Borg Collective, there would be no more wars. No more futile fights between Star Fleet, the Romulan Empire and the C ...[text shortened]... ion is shared by all, and therefore truly free --hey Roger Stallman, there's a Utopia for you!!
Well, by being absorbed into the Collective we'd lose all trace of our individuality. Completely.
Your arguements about the wars though, I'm not sure - all that anamosity would be absorbed as well. What if the Cardassians were all absorbed, they'd want to wipe out the others.
But the information is shared by the Queens or hive leaders (I think its always been a queen) who is really out for themselves, yes?
Originally posted by turtlexIsn't losing one's sense of individuality a small price to pay for eternal peace? You only value your individuality because it's what you're used to. When Seven of Nine was disconnected from the Collective, she wanted to go back --it's what she'd gotten used to.
Well, by being absorbed into the Collective we'd lose all trace of our individuality. Completely.
Your arguements about the wars though, I'm not sure - all that anamosity would be absorbed as well. What if the Cardassians were all a ...[text shortened]... nk its always been a queen) who is really out for themselves, yes?
If the anamosity between species were to exist inside the Collective, then the Collective would never have gotten as strong as it was/is. I always understood that once you're absorbed, you lose the attachment to your background (but your history is shared by all). Something strange, though: even though lots of species have been added to the Collective, the Borg all look humanoid and all have pretty much the same height. Where are the (much smaller!) Talaxians, for example? Obviously, the Borg would look a lot less intimidating if they weren't so uniform... Which is --I assume-- the reason why US GI's all have the same haircut...
Again, what I understood from the show, is that information entered into the collective would be shared by all: they could each 'hear' eachother's voices.
Originally posted by StrayJayStrayJay - Great thoughts and a good train to follow.
Isn't losing one's sense of individuality a small price to pay for eternal peace? You only value your individuality because it's what you're used to. When Seven of Nine was disconnected from the Collective, she wanted to go back --it ...[text shortened]... ld be shared by all: they could each 'hear' eachother's voices.
I'm not sure about how to reply. I am a big believer in indivual thoughts and rights. As, I think, Trek was too (Dare I quote - "the needs of the many, out weigh the needs of the few, or the one" and then followed by - "the needs of the one out weigh the needs of the many or the few" - its TOS movie, but you get my gist).
I don't know much about the Borg. I don't think we ever got into discovering how they became a race or how they became so "human-like" in appearance. With the exception of the Queen who's head was shown to mutate or whatever. I mean, her head pops off! Right!
You make an excellent point about Seven of Nine. That was an interesting aspect of her character, but also - she was used to show how being an individual was better for everyone. Her uniqueness, if you will, added to the betterment of the society of those on Voyager. Rather than just her memories or knowledge adding to the Collective.
Picard, when be became Lucutis of Borg, he also struggled with being called back to the Collective and "hearing" them.
However, what on your thoughts of Picard - Is not StarFleet better off with him as an individual?
In general, I'd say my favourite ones were the ones based around the nature of reality, illusion, tricks of the mind and time. Generally Data centric episodes or ones where they were trapped.
Eg one episode where the episode started with the ship being destroyed, and continued in a time loop, or another where there was some kind of holographic prison involved.
The poorest episodes I found generally revolved around namby-pamby idealistic commentry, or Worf.
Originally posted by turtlexTurtlex,
After foolishing falling for the TOS post - thinking it was a reference to The Original Series (star trek speak for the kirk years) - I got into a small discussion with prad regarding TNG.
We thought it might be some fun talking about TNG and its 7 year run.
Of all the Trek series, TNG is my favorite. It is the series, IMHO, most respectful to the P ...[text shortened]... , kindness, family, etc.
Lets pick one and discuss!
Live Long and Prosper.
IDIC.
turtlex
I thought this series was great too for the reasons you mentioned. It shows how humanity can evolve into better beings and keep on that journey.
Measure of a Man was definitely one of my favorites. One of the scenes i also liked in it was at the end when Riker was feeling absolutely miserable about arguing against Picard (as he had been forced to do). He tells Data how horrible he is feeling since he almost cost Data his life. And Data says to him, "That action injured you and saved me. I will not forget." That was such a poignant moment...
I also really liked the episode "Offspring".
in peace
Ranjana