Thanks for answering that question Xanthos.
But I still dont get it I guess.
Buz the Chessman was banned for 3b?
I never played the guy but he must be one of the most incompetent engine users because his graph shows him losing to 1700 players all the time!
Plus he had played almost 1000 games and was just now busted. Gaura got 3000+ or something insane like that.
It seems as if Gaura was long since suspected and Myrthir was definitely thought a cheat by everyone over 2200 who wouldnt take his invite.
So do Gaura and Buz selectively utilize their engines? is that why it was harder to catch them and took so long?
I am just always puzzled at the discrepancy in # of games played among the 3b users.
I guess some people are way more obvious about their use, but if so many people openly suspect someone like Gaura for 2+ years why does it take as long vs the relatively short time Stroubidoul took to get busted?
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Originally posted by XanthosNZNoop, we had three Clanmembers of S.P.S. removed from this site based on 3(b). (Trains44, cosmicknight and now GauravV)
You really are desperate to pretend that you didn't have a che@ter playing challenges for you aren't you? Guess what, you did. Again.
Trains44 played 8 Clangames for us (4 wins, 2 loses and 2 drawn)
cosmicknight played 2 Clangames for us (2 losses)
btw the losses were T-O's from after the removing.
GauravV played 38 Clangames for us (13 wins, 13 losses, 5 drawn and 7 still ongoing (will be losses on T-O's)
We all know that smiffy asked you to join our Clan in a PM, you joined, caused trouble in our private Clanforum and left (or where you kicked?) after only 30 minutes.
Anyway my personal problem with you is that you are always accusing and "teasing" our Clan (20 members) for some reason.
What is wrong with a Clanleader that wants to have an as strong as possible Clan?
Do you have a personal problem with S.P.S.??
Originally posted by briancronUnderstood, I think that most of players on the site have also never used an engine. Akizy is the player who is currently top on rating in the player tables. I was more replying to flexmore than you, but was trying to answer your question as well, and as you were replying to his point I quoted you instead of him.
What I am saying is that I was here in 2002 and using a computer was not a widely accepted thing. I wouldn't have had any wins if everyone was using a computer. Unless I did too... but that would be pointless as my goal is to improve, not have a high rating.
I guess what you are saying is that it was rampant but illegal and some time in 2003/4 the sit ...[text shortened]... or developed a good system.
I don't know Akizy or his games, I was speaking more generally.
At the time the games mod system was introduced a message was sent to everyone on the site reminding us of the requirement not to use engines under the terms of service. As far as I can tell everyone who has been banned (at least those on the list of removed players) used engines after that message was sent and there's really no excuse for that. This stuff about Akizy goes back to before the system was introduced; also it was in his profile, where he said he wouldn't use them in clan or tournament games or if you asked him not to. There's an obvious difference to IronMan31 et al. so I don't think flexmore's point works particularly well.
Originally posted by Loose ScrewDo I have a problem with a clan that appears to have more than it's fair share of banned cheaters? It's understandable that even the most aware clan leader misses cheaters sometimes. The Guttersnipes had Humper and actually that was my slip up. I approached him to become a member during a game we played after I did some quick engine checking (which came up clean). He was later found to be a cheater by the site admin and banned. Remember it's impossible to prove someone isn't a cheater.
Noop, we had three Clanmembers of S.P.S. removed from this site based on 3(b). (Trains44, cosmicknight and now GauravV)
Trains44 played 8 Clangames for us (4 wins, 2 loses and 2 drawn)
cosmicknight played 2 Clangames for us (2 losses)
btw the losses were T-O's from after the removing.
GauravV played 38 Clangames for us (13 wins, 13 losses, 5 draw ...[text shortened]... wants to have an as strong as possible Clan?
Do you have a personal problem with S.P.S.??
But a clan where you've had 3 players banned so far? Either smiffy isn't very discerning, doesn't seem to be able to pick a cheat or is out to try and gain advantage by recruiting cheaters (the last one seems unlikely).
Personally I think it's a mixture of the first two. Right up to the end of cosmicknight when the writing was on the wall Smiffy was out there telling everyone that [cosmicknight] was a very good player and a nice guy (the last bit is especially hilarious).
So tell me (or get Smiffy to tell me) what do the SPS plan on doing to stop the recruitment of cheaters happening in the future? Is there a plan? Surely it's not in your best interest to keep having members banned.
PS. I join every clan that PMs me asking for membership, mess with their forum and leave.
- Joined
- 21 Apr 06
- Moves
- 4211
Originally posted by XanthosNZPS. I join every clan that PMs me asking for membership, mess with their forum and leave.
Do I have a problem with a clan that appears to have more than it's fair share of banned cheaters? It's understandable that even the most aware clan leader misses cheaters sometimes. The Guttersnipes had Humper and actually that was my slip up. I approached him to become a member during a game we played after I did some quick engine checking (which came up ...[text shortened]... . I join every clan that PMs me asking for membership, mess with their forum and leave.
Because?
- Joined
- 21 Apr 06
- Moves
- 4211
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Originally posted by XanthosNZI guess if you had a note to that effect then your actions arent too bad. "I like messing with people" sounds like something a 14 year old kid would say while thinking he was 'cool'.
I like messing with people? And at the time smiffy PMed me I had a note in my profile saying that I only played for one clan and it was staying that way.
Originally posted by XanthosNZYup, he was cheating, and im not sure where you get off accusing me of pretending anything.
You really are desperate to pretend that you didn't have a che@ter playing challenges for you aren't you? Guess what, you did. Again.
Time? You really think scoring 50% against top flight opposition would take less time if you didn't use an engine?
And anyway, what evidence is there that GauravV is anything other than a weak player with an engine? If ...[text shortened]... es) then che@ting doesn't make sense and he'd be better at che@ting than the other che@ts.
Originally posted by XanthosNZI'm sure he will institute a program where he goes to everyone's house and gather up their chess computers. I'm giving him my frequent flier miles.
Do I have a problem with a clan that appears to have more than it's fair share of banned cheaters? It's understandable that even the most aware clan leader misses cheaters sometimes. The Guttersnipes had Humper and actually that was my slip up. I approached him to become a member during a game we played after I did some quick engine checking (which came up ...[text shortened]... . I join every clan that PMs me asking for membership, mess with their forum and leave.
The real answer is, its not anyone's job to do more than report cheats and let the admins deal with them. And its certainly not your responsibility to demand explanations from anyone here, unless you became an admin while nobody was looking.
The Game Mods have asked that accusations be provided along with whatever evidence you have. If that evidence is a crazy graph or a comparison between old games and new that's fine. But what if the evidence I have is that the player matched an engine 90% of the time across the games I tested? Should I provide that?
It makes sense to and helps the Game Mods seperate real accusations from the spiteful "I lost so he must be che@ting" ones.
And to analyse potential/new members to ensure they aren't cheaters? It just makes good sense. You ensure that the clan doesn't end up in disrepute and also that you don't end up losing a whole bunch of games because a member got banned.
And as to accusing you of pretending that GauravV wasn't che@ting for your clan, I didn't. I accused Loose Screw of that. Right after he claimed that he couldn't see that GauravV was che@ting for your clan. See how that works?
You know RoboMod keying on Che ating is really really pissing me off.
Originally posted by XanthosNZWhats a crazy graph? Someone accused me of having a crazy graph becasue I went from 1400 to 1900 but hang on a moment to get from 1200 where I started to 1900 don't I have to go through 1400 and yes my rating dropped at the beginning (in my 1st 20 games) but I wasn't even losing them so was that my fault? Does that indicate che@ting? I sincerely hope not. A graph is only crazy when you continually make elementary strategical and tactical blunders and stay around 1400 for 100s of games then suddenly your grasp of strategy and tactics improves out of sight and you start beating 2000 rated players and shoot up to 2200. You don't lose to a 1400 one day and beat a 2200 the next (if you are that strong you can give a 1400 a piece and still win). Such improvements are gradual with many plateaus along the way as you consolidate and move to the next phase and improvements in strategical play will be slower than tactics which in turn will be slower than openings (where due to use of books improvements can be dramatic and quick). Improvements in endings will only come when you actually start getting to more complex endings which most 1400 don't.
The Game Mods have asked that accusations be provided along with whatever evidence you have. If that evidence is a crazy graph or a comparison between old games and new that's fine. But what if the evidence I have is that the player matched an engine 90% of the time across the games I tested? Should I provide that?
It makes sense to and helps the Game Mo ...[text shortened]... ow that works?
You know RoboMod keying on Che ating is really really pissing me off.
and all of these needs to be backed up by comprehensive analysis against engines that shows a consistently improbably high match.
I presume this was done.
Originally posted by Dragon FireI know it was done. The Game Mods only ban once overwhelming evidence is presented.
Whats a crazy graph? Someone accused me of having a crazy graph becasue I went from 1400 to 1900 but hang on a moment to get from 1200 where I started to 1900 don't I have to go through 1400 and yes my rating dropped at the beginning (in my 1st 20 games) but I wasn't even losing them so was that my fault? Does that indicate che@ting? I sincerely hope not ...[text shortened]... engines that shows a consistently [b]improbably high match.
I presume this was done.[/b]
And yes a crazy graph is one that stays constant for a while and then shoots off skyward. There have been players who have done that. Starting from 1200 and getting to 1900 is not a crazy graph.
Originally posted by XanthosNZI guess you are talking about this sentence:
And as to accusing you of pretending that GauravV wasn't che@ting for your clan, I didn't. I accused Loose Screw of that. Right after he claimed that he couldn't see that GauravV was che@ting for your clan. See how that works?
Originally posted by Loose Screw
So, based on these statistics, I don't get the absolute evidence or feeling that he cheated during his Clangames for S.P.S., do you?
I just looked at the stats of GauravV for our Clan and looking at that I can't see anything suspicious.
I mean you would expect from a che@ter that he only get wins a couple of draws and almost no losses.
You can blame me for that, but I don't have a Fritz or what ever it's called to check peoples moves.