PAWN RIOT VS The Forum Move 14

Very Nice 🙂

Originally posted by !~TONY~!
19. Kd2 then 19...d5! looks good, since 20. g5 Nh5 21. exd5 Nf4 threatens threatens ...Nxd5, and gives Black good play.

19...Bxg4 is also certainly a possibility. Maybe if your plan is Kd2, then g5 should be played first. This also prevents the ...Be8 and ...Nd7 plan.

Hey, with robbie's line Black is OK; then we could anyway play ...Qb7 and ...Be6 and start causing lil problems over c/b files pushing further on the white squares etc.
Fos starters I vote 14...b5 15. b3 b4 16. bxc4 bxc3 17.Qxc3 Qc7 , what the f^$#, we 'ld rather burn than disappear
😵

Originally posted by paulbuchmanfromfics
This is not a vote or a suggestion.

The first move I am looking at is 14. ... Bxg4.

This may be a little extreme but it does really put a halt to white's play.

I can't find a good response to 15.fxg4 Nxg4 16.h3 (16.Rdg1? Nxe3 and Bxd4) Ne5 (maybe something else is better) 17.Bh6 ... oh wait 17. ... Rxd4.

I still don't trust this 10 ...[text shortened]... nsation. It's usually just a freedom of pieces/good central control kind of compensation.

I've tried somethign similar on occasion, but what you're basically doing is saccing a piece for 2 pawns to give white what he is prepared to sac a pawn for: opening files into black's king.

D

Originally posted by black beetle
Hey, with robbie's line Black is OK; then we could anyway play ...Qb7 and ...Be6 and start causing lil problems over c/b files pushing further on the white squares etc.
Fos starters I vote 14...b5 15. b3 b4 16. bxc4 bxc3 17.Qxc3 Qc7 , what the f^$#, we 'ld rather burn than disappear
😵

yes i agree with the illustrious beetle, Robbie's line is amazing, i vote for 14....b5

I think now that we've played 12...Nc4, the only real choice here is 14...b5!

that was my move too, you know what they say about great minds thinking alike...

OK ... Does anyone have any more variations (good or bad) to discuss before we start voting?

Originally posted by paulbuchmanfromfics
OK ... Does anyone have any more variations (good or bad) to discuss before we start voting?

no its been decided!

Before we vote the following moves should be considered:

14...Qb8 sample line: 15.g5 Nh5 16.Nd5 Re8 17.Ne2 Be5 18.Qd3 b5
This line is my favorite. In fact, I don't think white has anything with this line except the minimal opening advantage.

14...Qa5 sample line: 15.g5 Ne8 16.Nb3 Qd8 17.Bd4 Bxd4 18.Nxd4 Ng7

14...a6 I have one game in my database with this move. 15.h4 b5 16.h5 b4 17.Nd5 Nxd5 18.exd5 Be5

Dearing gives:

14...Qb8 15. g5!? Nh5 16. b3 Rcc8 17. Nd5 Rfe8 18. Ne2 Be6 19. Ng3 Bxd5 20. exd5 Qc7 21. Nxh5 gxh5 22. f4 a5 f5 as clearly better for White.

Originally posted by !~TONY~!
Dearing gives:

14...Qb8 15. g5!? Nh5 16. b3 Rcc8 17. Nd5 Rfe8 18. Ne2 Be6 19. Ng3 Bxd5 20. exd5 Qc7 21. Nxh5 gxh5 22. f4 a5 f5 as clearly better for White.

Clearly better? I doubt it.

our 23rd move we have plenty of options:

Be5, Qc3,b5,a4

a4 is probably the best, at least it looks mean.

Qc3 (threatening mate) and the queens come off; I'm betting this is drawn.

Originally posted by ResigningSoon
Clearly better? I doubt it.

our 23rd move we have plenty of options:

Be5, Qc3,b5,a4

a4 is probably the best, at least it looks mean.

Qc3 (threatening mate) and the queens come off; I'm betting this is drawn.

I don't.

23...Qc3 24. Qxc3 Bxc3 25. Bd4 Bxd4 26. Rxd4 is definitely a lot better for White.

23...a4 24. f6! exf6 25. gxf6 Bxf6 26. Rhg1+ Kf8 27. Bh6+ Ke7 28. Bg5! and I doubt Black will survive.

23...b5 just looks slower than ...a4 immediately, I don't see why White isn't better after something like 24. Rhf1 Be5 25. Rf2! a4 26. Bd4 Bxd4 27. Qxd4 axb3 28. cxb3! Qc3 29. Qxc3 Rxc3 30. Kb2

etc.... Black's best move on move 23 is probably 23...Bc3, although I'd still guess White is better. Regardless, Black's chances seem quite limited here, whether the queens are on or not.

Dearing's "Play the Sicilian Dragon" considers 4 options at move 14 for Black here:

A: 14...b5
B: 14...Qa5
C: 14...Qc7!?
D: 14...Qb8

(Dearing himself favours 12...Re8 over 12...Nc4, but that was before the discovery of 17...Qc7 in the 14...b5 line as a possible solution to Black's problems)

Dearing's main line of variation C:

14...Qc7!? 15 g5 Nh5 16 Nd5 Qd8 17 Ne2! Be6!?

Fedorov recently (Dearing's book was published in 2004) preferred 17...e6.

After 17...e6 White's critical continuation is 18 Ndf4 (18 Nb4 was the move played in the Fedorov game) 18...Nxf4 19 Nxf4 Rc6 20 h4 Qc7 21 h5 Rc8 22 Rc1 Ra6 (22...Rc3 23 hxg6 hxg6 24 Bd4 Rxf3 25 Bxg7 Kxg7 26 Qh2 +-; 22...b5 23 hxg6 hxg6 24 Bd4 Rxc2 25 Rxc2 Qxc2+ 26 Qxc2 Rxc2 27 Bxg7 +-) 23 hxg6, Kolev-Alterman, Burgas, 1995, which Korchnoi assesses as clearly better for White.

So maybe this line does not merit too much further consideration!

Originally posted by !~TONY~!
I don't.

23...Qc3 24. Qxc3 Bxc3 25. Bd4 Bxd4 26. Rxd4 is definitely a lot better for White.

23...a4 24. f6! exf6 25. gxf6 Bxf6 26. Rhg1+ Kf8 27. Bh6+ Ke7 28. Bg5! and I doubt Black will survive.

23...b5 just looks slower than ...a4 immediately, I don't see why White isn't better after something like 24. Rhf1 Be5 25. Rf2! a4 26. Bd4 Bxd4 27. Qxd4 ...[text shortened]... er. Regardless, Black's chances seem quite limited here, whether the queens are on or not.

23...Qc3 24. Qxc3 Bxc3 25.Bd4 b5! white has nothing 25.Rd3 Bxd4 etc.

23...a4 24.f6 exf6 25.gxf6 axb3! equality...