Originally posted by josephwSo, if I cannot possibly know the truth without accepting that Jesus is God's son, and without having the holy spirit in me, then what are you doing wasting your words trying to expound the truth to me and convince me of it. You surely don't claim to be Jesus or the holy spirit, but it seems to me that you don't trust Jesus to do his own explaining?
[b]"perhaps religion is so entrenched in your mind..."
On the contrary. I have no "religious" thoughts at all.
What I believe is "truth". That is, objective truth that has it's origin in the person of Jesus Christ.
"...how do we know that the bible is god's word?"
It begins with the realization of who Jesus is. Untill you know and bel ...[text shortened]... died for you personally, and then have the Holy Spirit in you, you won't know at all.[/b]
Is it your contention that you can do a better job of converting the sinners than the God who created them?
Originally posted by josephw"Objective truth"
[b]"perhaps religion is so entrenched in your mind..."
On the contrary. I have no "religious" thoughts at all.
What I believe is "truth". That is, objective truth that has it's origin in the person of Jesus Christ.
"...how do we know that the bible is god's word?"
It begins with the realization of who Jesus is. Untill you know and bel ...[text shortened]... died for you personally, and then have the Holy Spirit in you, you won't know at all.[/b]
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Originally posted by ZahlanziThe design lives on and it has withstood the introduction of sin, and
why take one at all? since god would wipe them anyway? since we never find a t-rex in any egyptian or sumerian drawing, then it is safe to assume they were wiped before somewhere after 6000 years and 5000 ago.
so god creates an entire ecosystem of animals just to have it destroyed during the course of roughly 1000 years. intelligent design? not so intel ...[text shortened]... dering idiot. i hold him to be quite smart comming up with the brilliant idea that is evolution.
since sin was and is the real issue, that has been dealt with! The
purposes of God are still moving forward in spite of our misuse of
the freewill we were given early on. Since God is working on an
eternal goal I don't see why you'd think a few thousand years of
grief caused by sin that will never be able to rise up again as a
failure of the design.
Kelly
Originally posted by freightdog37the fewer numbers would have made it difficult for all animals to reproduce, including humans. how come some got wiped and some didn't?
The whole thing sounded a little silly to me until I really started to search for myself. The more I searched the more I believed. This happens a lot with many PhD scientists. They are converted to a faith because of what they discover.
To relate to your quote. There are pictographs of dinosaurs in caves. To expand on Kelly's point of what hap ...[text shortened]... larger animals to reproduce as is. This is one of the reasons for Wholly Mammoths extinctions.
Originally posted by josephwso if someone claims he is speaking with jesus and jesus says we must eat cake on fridays, will you listen to him? there a lot of scriptures not included in the bible, by men, what if they are true also? what if someone mistranslated a part of the bible or misinterpreted it?
[b]"perhaps religion is so entrenched in your mind..."
On the contrary. I have no "religious" thoughts at all.
What I believe is "truth". That is, objective truth that has it's origin in the person of Jesus Christ.
"...how do we know that the bible is god's word?"
It begins with the realization of who Jesus is. Untill you know and bel ...[text shortened]... died for you personally, and then have the Holy Spirit in you, you won't know at all.[/b]
who gets to decide what is the truth?
"It begins with the realization of who Jesus is. Untill you know and believe that Jesus is the son of God, and that He died for your sins, and trust in the fact that He died for you personally, and then have the Holy Spirit in you, you won't know at all"
in other words, i don't really believe jesus is my savior because i find the flood story preposterous. so in order to know the truth one must accept every part of the bible as absolute, including the parts where god commands the jews to commit genocide, ethnic and religious cleansing, including the idiotic parts where god creates the plants before the sun, including the parts where god commands adulterous women to be stoned to death.
so i am not really a christian simply because i follow christ's message of love and compassion and fuzzy feelings. in order to be a full membership christian i must accept all the passages in the bible that have no freakin connection with christ and his message whatsoever.
perhaps if you read your post more carefully, maybe from a different angle you will understand how many levels of insanity transpire from it.
Originally posted by KellyJayi am saying that the flood is illogical.
The design lives on and it has withstood the introduction of sin, and
since sin was and is the real issue, that has been dealt with! The
purposes of God are still moving forward in spite of our misuse of
the freewill we were given early on. Since God is working on an
eternal goal I don't see why you'd think a few thousand years of
grief caused by sin that will never be able to rise up again as a
failure of the design.
Kelly
-the world of man was full of sin.
-god is in theory all knowing.
-god destroys his creation because of the sin, except one man to start creation fresh
-god promises not to destroy the world in a flood
-the world of man is full of sin.
either god was bored and thought "what the f, let's try a flood maybe it will work" which might mean he is not all knowing, or he performed a completely pointless act, which might make him an idiot, evil, bored, unpredictable etc.
but of course you have an answer to that also, don't you. whenever god apparently performs an act that is completely illogical to us, god must work in mysterious ways.
Originally posted by ZahlanziI'm not sure what you are asking. I think you are asking why so became extinct and some didn't. I think that we have already established that all creatures where on board the ark. So are you asking why some creatures like the dinosaurs died out after everyone got off the ark?
the fewer numbers would have made it difficult for all animals to reproduce, including humans. how come some got wiped and some didn't?
Originally posted by FabianFnasThere is a lot of science in the bible. The bible was the first to declare the world as round.
This is a classic example of an explanation à la "God did it that way, he can do anything, he is almighty! If we cannot understand this is because our intelect is limited compared to that of god's."
Therefore I say again, and again, that religion and science cannot ever be mixed. Trying to explain the flood scientifically is to deny god or belittle him to be a mear mortal human being with no divine qualities.
Originally posted by ZahlanziIt goes back to are our choices real or not, if they are yes the flood
i am saying that the flood is illogical.
-the world of man was full of sin.
-god is in theory all knowing.
-god destroys his creation because of the sin, except one man to start creation fresh
-god promises not to destroy the world in a flood
-the world of man is full of sin.
either god was bored and thought "what the f, let's try a flood maybe ...[text shortened]... rently performs an act that is completely illogical to us, god must work in mysterious ways.
and all that happens before and after sin becomes very important to
the reality of the universe.
Kelly
Originally posted by freightdog37Where does it do that, and are you really sure it is the oldest source of such a claim? And does it say 'round' or 'spherical'?
There is a lot of science in the bible. The bible was the first to declare the world as round.
I seem to remember references to a dome in genesis but I do not know the correct translation of the original Hebrew.
Originally posted by twhiteheadAmusing you are worried about the earth being called round or a
Where does it do that, and are you really sure it is the oldest source of such a claim? And does it say 'round' or 'spherical'?
I seem to remember references to a dome in genesis but I do not know the correct translation of the original Hebrew.
spherical in scripture, when you deny straight lines. 🙂 Neither here or
there, just amusing to me.
Kelly
Originally posted by KellyJayShow me the verse that claims that the Earth is round, and we take it from there.
What does it say about that, and where does it say it since you seem
to know by claiming you know what the Bible doesn't say.
Kelly
freightdog37 knows the verse (he's referring to it), do you?
Originally posted by KellyJayWhats more amusing is that you interpret my claims in other threads regarding your definition of a straight line as "denying straight lines".
Amusing you are worried about the earth being called round or a
spherical in scripture, when you deny straight lines. 🙂 Neither here or
there, just amusing to me.
Kelly
If what you meant was that I deny the existence of a line that is simultaneously straight in all dimensions and wholly contained in the physical universe then yes I not only deny it but it is a trivial result of the fact that spacetime is not flat. If you dispute that, then you are saying that Einsteins General Theory of Relativity is false. You are free to do so, but your position then becomes the more amusing one (or more scary depending on the way you look at it).