Are the signs not obvious?

Originally posted by LemonJello
nothing but empty propaganda. do you ever inspect your food before digging in?

it's one straw man and fallacious line of argument after another. the author actually 'argues' from evolution to the claim that "It is no big deal to abort unborn children or to abuse your body with drugs or alcohol." yeah, that's what evolutionists necessarily think. 🙄🙄

CB, you need to wake up and smell what you're shoveling around.

Although I don't entirely agree with everything there, LJ, the point you are missing is with an evolutionary worldview there is no problem with aborting babies, genocide and rape. I'm not saying that all evolutionists are rapists, but from a purely evolutionary perspective you sure can't have a problem with survival of the fittest. I know you are going to pull the old trick of natural law, but just explain how random chance came up with that, and how you can force somebody to obey it from a purely evolutionary perspective? As I've told you before, evolution don't give anybody morals, you have to piggyback it on another philosophy. Thats where the problem lies. If evolution is a fact, why can't it be a philosophy on its own?

Originally posted by RazzleBreezer
Isn't it obvious now that some sort of God exists? I mean Science has not yet been able to disprove religion so far. Also, the earth is so complicated that it can't be chance that it exists. Yeah, yeah I know that perhaps there are trillions of universes with every possibility of life and we just happen to live in the right one, bla bla bla, but if t ...[text shortened]... l enough to create the earth anyway. Can some atheist somewhere explain this puzzling conundrum?

"Isn't it obvious now that some sort of God exists?
NO
"I mean Science has not yet been able to disprove religion so far". Propose some property of god thats testable.

"the earth is so complicated that it can't be chance that it exists"
Complicated to you maybe ,but is it complicated to Quantum mechanics?

"perhaps there are trillions of universes with every possibility of life and we just happen to live in the right one, bla bla bla,"
ok that proves it : we don't exist.

"if there are so many possibilities of life, surely one of them would have a God in it powerful enough to create the earth anyway"
surely you jest and on a lighter note: NO!

"Can some atheist somewhere explain this puzzling conundrum?"
I'm not an atheist but that doesn't make me puzzled over the mechanisms that gave rise to the Universe , the galaxies, stars , planet and life . each had and have it's own puzzles to solve.

The existence of the universe only proves it's own existence, only that and nothing more. The same applies to the earth and life on it. I addressed your questions in the semantic environment that you created , but just to be perfectly clear Genesis 1 is not in any way how the Universe and things in it came into existence.

Originally posted by frogstomp

The existence of the universe only proves it's own existence, only that and nothing more. The same applies to the earth and life on it. I addressed your questions in the semantic environment that you created , but just to be perfectly clear Genesis 1 is not in any way how the Universe and things in it came into existence.

It's a good night tonight.

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
It's a good night tonight.

Rainy and a peasoup of fog in my neck of the woods.

Originally posted by Halitose
Although I don't entirely agree with everything there, LJ, the point you are missing is with an evolutionary worldview there [b]is no problem with aborting babies, genocide and rape. I'm not saying that all evolutionists are rapists, but from a purely evolutionary perspective you sure can't have a problem with survival of the fittest. I know you are ...[text shortened]... Thats where the problem lies. If evolution is a fact, why can't it be a philosophy on its own?[/b]

Gravity is a fact; does it have to be a philosophy on its own??

And you are misinformed about evolution being "random chance" and certainly don't understand "survival of the fittest" (not that Darwin ever used the term). You need to read up on evolutionary theory in reputable science books, not Christian websites, if you are to understand it enough to critique it.

Originally posted by Halitose
Although I don't entirely agree with everything there, LJ, the point you are missing is with an evolutionary worldview there [b]is no problem with aborting babies, genocide and rape. I'm not saying that all evolutionists are rapists, but from a purely evolutionary perspective you sure can't have a problem with survival of the fittest. I know you are ...[text shortened]... Thats where the problem lies. If evolution is a fact, why can't it be a philosophy on its own?[/b]

Your problem is with "survival of the fittest" which to an evolutionist means a species changing to fit a major enviromental change , genetic variants exists inside all species and some variants can adapt to the new environment .

Although it was "discredited " by proponents of Random Mutation caused by radiation LaMarckian evolution seems to play a part in speciation.( look up epigenetics )

Biological processes are not Philosophy

Originally posted by Halitose
Rainy and a peasoup of fog in my neck of the woods.

I make a fantastic peasoup.

Originally posted by no1marauder
Gravity is a fact; does it have to be a philosophy on its own??

And you are misinformed about evolution being "random chance" and certainly don't understand "survival of the fittest" (not that Darwin ever used the term). You need to read up on evolutionary theory in reputable science books, not Christian websites, if you are to understand it enough to critique it.

My thoughts on the writers of the OT is that they proved they were racists when the wrote God answered Moses question about His name with " ! am "
you can tell em da joke ifn ya want. lol

Originally posted by Halitose
Although I don't entirely agree with everything there, LJ, the point you are missing is with an evolutionary worldview there is no problem with aborting babies, genocide and rape. I'm not saying that all evolutionists are rapists, but from a purely evolutionary perspective you sure can't have a problem with survival of the fittest. I know you are going t ...[text shortened]... Thats where the problem lies. If evolution is a fact, why can't it be a philosophy on its own?

first, you seem supremely ignorant of the fact that theism and evolution are compatible on many levels of belief.

second, if an evolutionist subscribes to an ethical theory which says that rape is morally wrong, then according to this evolutionist's worldview, there IS a problem with rape. what, exactly, don't you get about that? one's perception of morality comes from ethical treatment; why do you assume that it is a strike against evolution if "evolution don't (sic) give anybody morals"?

third, you grossly misconstrue the views of many evolutionists with your 'survival of the fittest' misconceptions.

fourth, come a say huh?:
If evolution is a fact, why can't it be a philosophy on its own?
what on earth are you talking about?

Originally posted by Halitose
Although I don't entirely agree with everything there, LJ, the point you are missing is with an evolutionary worldview there [b]is no problem with aborting babies, genocide and rape. I'm not saying that all evolutionists are rapists, but from a purely evolutionary perspective you sure can't have a problem with survival of the fittest. I know you are ...[text shortened]... Thats where the problem lies. If evolution is a fact, why can't it be a philosophy on its own?[/b]

with an evolutionary worldview there is no problem with aborting babies, genocide and rape

This is nonsense.
TOE attempts to show how life has evolved, period.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
Not to mention how complex human beings are. Science cannot even reproduce a human organ.

Ps 53:1
1 The fool has said in his heart, "There is no God."
(NKJ)

🙂

I'd say its pretty amazing how far humans who after all have an
average IQ of only 100, have come. You bitch and moan about
how much humans don't know yna yna yna you say, my god knows
more than you do. All you have are words, thats all you ever had
thats all you ever WILL have are words. Human ability on the other
hand, grows with each passing year. Maybe the US won't be the king
of the hill but the human race gets more powerfull every year and
maybe, just maybe, these people with that pathetic average IQ of
100 will do something that may amaze even you, although I can
already hear your response...

Originally posted by no1marauder
Gravity is a fact; does it have to be a philosophy on its own??

And you are misinformed about evolution being "random chance" and certainly don't understand "survival of the fittest" (not that Darwin ever used the term). You need to read up on evolutionary theory in reputable science books, not Christian websites, if you are to understand it enough to critique it.

Ah! The "you are stupid and don't know what you are talking about", wildcard. I should have predicted it, so you'd actually have to to think of something else to throw. You must be a lawyer.

phi·los·o·phy (fĭ-lŏs'ə-f)
n., pl. -phies.
1. Love and pursuit of wisdom by intellectual means and moral self-discipline.
2. Investigation of the nature, causes, or principles of reality, knowledge, or values, based on logical reasoning rather than empirical methods.
3. A system of thought based on or involving such inquiry: the philosophy of Hume.
4. The critical analysis of fundamental assumptions or beliefs.
5. The disciplines presented in university curriculums of science and the liberal arts, except medicine, law, and theology.
6. The discipline comprising logic, ethics, aesthetics, metaphysics, and epistemology.
7. A set of ideas or beliefs relating to a particular field or activity; an underlying theory: an original philosophy of advertising.
8. A system of values by which one lives: has an unusual philosophy of life.

Evolution is the explanation on how we got here, Gravity is an explanation on why we stay here. Why can't evolution be an axiom from which to derive our morals?

Evolutionists who have these supposedly "good" morals, piggyback them off another philosophy. Evolution sure doesn't teach you that.

Originally posted by LemonJello
first, you seem supremely ignorant of the fact that theism and evolution are compatible on many levels of belief.

second, if an evolutionist subscribes to an ethical theory which says that rape is morally wrong, then according to this evolutionist's worldview, there IS a problem with rape. what, exactly, don't you get about that? one's perception ...[text shortened]... n is a fact, why can't it be a philosophy on its own?
what on earth are you talking about?[/b]

first, you seem supremely ignorant of the fact that theism and evolution are compatible on many levels of belief.

Sure, just show me the god who will use millenia of pain and death to finally create mankind. This must be a weakling of a god who can't get things right the first time. This god of yours sure wouldn't be worthy of worship.

second, if an evolutionist subscribes to an ethical theory which says that rape is morally wrong, then according to this evolutionist's worldview, there IS a problem with rape. what, exactly, don't you get about that?

I get it fine. Read my post on the piggybacking. My point was when you take it from a purely evolutionary perspective and derive morals from there.

why do you assume that it is a strike against evolution if "evolution don't (sic) give anybody morals"?

Because it can definitely be used as an excuse for genocide etc. You think Hitler's views of the supreme Aryan and sub-human Jew weren't influenced by evolution?

third, you grossly misconstrue the views of many evolutionists with your 'survival of the fittest' misconceptions.

I agree with you. Most evolutionists are probably generaly good people making a living somewhere in their lab. This does not mean that everybody is seeing it their way.

what on earth are you talking about?

Using evolution as the epistemology of morality.

Originally posted by KneverKnight
[b] with an evolutionary worldview there is no problem with aborting babies, genocide and rape

This is nonsense.
TOE attempts to show how life has evolved, period.[/b]

Maybe that's what it was originally meant to show. When using evolution as a basis for a worldview and not getting much other positive input, isn't rape and murder just part of the evolutionary process?

Originally posted by frogstomp
Your problem is with "survival of the fittest" which to an evolutionist means a species changing to fit a major enviromental change , genetic variants exists inside all species and some variants can adapt to the new environment .

Although it was "discredited " by proponents of Random Mutation caused by radiation LaMa ...[text shortened]... a part in speciation.( look up epigenetics )

Biological processes are not Philosophy

Biological processes are not Philosophy

I'm sure you have a philosophy on sex. 😛

But I get your point...