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    15 Nov '14 18:14
    Nooooo. 😲

    Surely not? I never would have thought.

    http://youtu.be/k6PWFvzKl3I
  2. Standard membersonship
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    15 Nov '14 20:516 edits
    Originally posted by C Hess
    Nooooo. 😲

    Surely not? I never would have thought.

    http://youtu.be/k6PWFvzKl3I
    Oh! Absolutely crushing.
    We believers in Jesus are DEVASTASHED !

    But then again - what some other NT scholars with equivalent training would say -

    Bart Erhman verses Graig Evans - debate

    "Does the New Testament Present a Reliable Portrait of Jesus?"

    YouTube

    William Lane Craig lectures on Bart Erhman - a lecture

    "Historical Text, Historical Savior; Answering Bart Erhman's Critque of the Historical Jesus "

    YouTube

    Norm Giesler on Bart Erhman -

    "The Errors of Bart Erhman"

    YouTube
  3. Joined
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    15 Nov '14 21:40
    Originally posted by sonship
    Oh! Absolutely crushing.
    We believers in Jesus are DEVASTASHED !

    But then again - what some other NT scholars with equivalent training would say -

    [b] Bart Erhman
    verses Graig Evans - debate

    "Does the New Testament Present a Reliable Portrait of Jesus?"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOnJSKBVrys

    William Lane Cr ...[text shortened]... -

    "The Errors of Bart Erhman"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mgt1Zz2_u3s[/b]
    I see that, and I raise with the true story of jesus's ressurection. Brace yourself:

    Jesus: the cover-up: http://youtu.be/7gvv_UM7CYg
  4. Standard memberRJHinds
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    15 Nov '14 22:281 edit
    Originally posted by C Hess
    I see that, and I raise with the true story of jesus's ressurection. Brace yourself:

    Jesus: the cover-up: http://youtu.be/7gvv_UM7CYg
    It might take awhile to find one funnier than that. 😀
  5. Standard membersonship
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    16 Nov '14 00:324 edits
    Originally posted by C Hess
    I see that, and I raise with the true story of jesus's ressurection. Brace yourself:

    Jesus: the cover-up: http://youtu.be/7gvv_UM7CYg
    While I check on it at leisure here's Derrell Bock, Ph.D. , co-author with Daniel Wallace, Ph.D, of "Dethroning Jesus: Exposing Popular Culture's Quest to Unseat the Biblical Christ" as he takes on Bart Erhman on live radio.

    "Was the New Testament Forged?" on live British talk program "Unbelievable".

    YouTube
  6. SubscriberFMF
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    16 Nov '14 00:34
    It seems to me that the addition of the Book of Revelation was one of the greatest instances of "tampering" with the Bible.
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    16 Nov '14 00:36
    Originally posted by FMF
    It seems to me that the addition of the Book of Revelation was one of the greatest instances of "tampering" with the Bible.
    Why so?
  8. SubscriberFMF
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    16 Nov '14 00:42
    Originally posted by sonship
    Why so?
    Where does its content come from?
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    16 Nov '14 01:30
    Originally posted by FMF
    Where does its content come from?
    The content is mostly a recapitulation of things revealed elsewhere in Scripture. It is a grand finale of the whole Bible. It is like the climax of a long symphony in which earlier themes are revisited.

    It hales back to Daniel, to Zechariah, to Exodus, to Isaiah and Ezekiel.

    Without Revelation the Bible has no real conclusion. You would be hard pressed to find much that is absolutely new in Revelation.

    John the writer, God used to write:

    1.) The last Gospel.
    2.) Virtually the last epistle.
    3.) The last book of the New Testament.
    4.) The last book of the entire Bible.

    God entrusted this beloved disciple with the last word many times.
    Jude comes after Third John. But Jude is practically a re-speaking of Second Peter.

    This disciple who was so close to Jesus, God ordained to pen the final word of the whole divine revelation of Scripture.

    While I might not encourage a new believer to start her reading with Revelation, I would strongly encourage it eventually after much of the Bible had been absorbed.
  10. SubscriberFMF
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    16 Nov '14 01:49
    Originally posted by sonship
    The content is mostly a recapitulation of things revealed elsewhere in Scripture. It is a grand finale of the whole Bible. It is like the climax of a long symphony in which earlier themes are revisited.
    What I asked was where does the actual content of the Book of Revelation come from?
  11. SubscriberFMF
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    16 Nov '14 01:51
    Originally posted by sonship
    Without Revelation the Bible has no real conclusion.
    And so someone wrote the stuff that's in it.
  12. Standard membersonship
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    16 Nov '14 02:06
    Originally posted by FMF
    And so someone wrote the stuff that's in it.
    The whole 66 books of the Bible were written.
    Did you think it came floating down from the sky with wings?
  13. SubscriberFMF
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    16 Nov '14 02:08
    Originally posted by sonship
    The whole 66 books of the Bible were written.
    Did you think it came floating down from the sky with wings?
    Indeed. But you've been dancing around since I asked you where the actual content of the Book of Revelation came from. I think I know why.
  14. Standard membersonship
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    16 Nov '14 02:09
    Originally posted by FMF
    And so someone wrote the stuff that's in it.
    I asked you a simple question - Why you thought the book of Revelation was evidence of a tampered with Bible.

    You responded with a question. Where did the content come from? you asked.

    You never told me why you think it evidences a tampered with Bible.
  15. Standard membersonship
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    16 Nov '14 02:101 edit
    Originally posted by FMF
    Indeed. But you've been dancing around since I asked you where the actual content of the Book of Revelation came from. I think I know why.
    You've danced around the question why you think Revelation evidences a tampered with Bible.

    I learned about Inspiration, Illumination, Transmission, and canonity from a good book by Norm Giesler - "A General Introduction to the Bible" .

    Lots of issues there. And lots of scholarly dealing with the objections, problems, and history of the OT and NT canon. I'm not going to re-write all those chapters post by post here.

    I recommend the book to others who are interested to know How God communicated a Book from God to us. That is as much as we can understand, and the different schools of thought where we are not sure.
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