12 Jun '07 14:53>
Originally posted by blakbuzzrdWhy?
I had no doubt.
Kelly
Originally posted by KellyJayKellyJay, I don't think this conversation can go much further. We're now at the point where all that is left is to talk about whether or not I was in fact a real Christian. It may be impossible to discuss, given our different perspectives.
Why?
Kelly
Originally posted by blakbuzzrd...but the one who wouldn't scruple to punch me square in the jaw for the sake of sanctifying me.
Sorry for the delay, KellyJay. I owe you this from some time back, so here's the short version:
Obviously, there's going to be a bit of a disconnect here, because you believe certain things that I don't anymore. That makes talking about it hard, because the terms we would use ourselves don't have much meaning in conversation with each other (e.g., "wal ...[text shortened]... them.
That was my faith.
And now it's gone.
You know, that kinda hurt.
Originally posted by blakbuzzrdI've read two of your posts one says you did walk away from Christ,
KellyJay, I don't think this conversation can go much further. We're now at the point where all that is left is to talk about whether or not I was in fact a real Christian. It may be impossible to discuss, given our different perspectives.
The best that can be said here is that I certainly believed myself to be Christian. To me, it was not rote, ritua llusory, except insofar as the person is more or less serious about his or her belief.
Originally posted by blakbuzzrdThere is a difference between someone taking you from his hand and you willfully walking away is'nt there?
[b]I have arrived. I have a thread calling me out by name now!
Now to bidness:
An evangelical xian maintains that if someone actually falls away from the faith, then that person wasn't really of the faith, since Christ promises to protect his own and that no one will take them from his hand (cf. John 10:27-29).
Originally posted by KellyJayIndeed. In fact, there is a whole slew of examples of this. Did not Adam and Eve "walk away"? Were they not "true converts"? I believe also in 1 Timothy 1:20 both Hymenaeus and Alexander walked away from the faith for various reasons. Also as I have been harping on on many other threads, we all have free will and for one to be UNABLE to walk away from the faith one would then have no free will. I simply do not believe this to be possible. However, if we CHOOSE to not walk away, who then can pluck us out of the hand of the Almighty? I believe Christ made the statement to not fear those who can kill you, rather, fear those who may be able to take your soul. How then is this possible? I say it is through deception. After all, if God be God then Satan is outgunned, so to speak. Direct confrontation is therefore suicidal. Therefore, the only means of attack is through deception just as it was in the garden.
They walked away from Jesus while He was here as a man and He let
them go.
Kelly