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Spirituality

Spirituality

  1. Standard member dj2becker
    rentrer à la maison
    28 May '18 08:41 / 1 edit
    Are there any real atheists left or are they all hiding behind agnosticism?

    If you were to ask someone whether they believed in the existence of God/god(s), they could either say yes (theist), no (atheist), or they don't know. (agnostic)

    Do we have any real atheists left that have the guts to truthfully answer this question: Does God exist?
  2. Standard member Romans1009
    Cretinous Mutterings
    28 May '18 08:45
    Originally posted by @dj2becker
    Are there any real atheists left or are they all hiding behind agnosticism?

    If you were to ask someone whether they believed in the existence of God/god(s), they could either say yes (theist), no (atheist), or they don't know. (agnostic)

    Do we have any real atheists left that have the guts to truthfully answer this question: Do you believe in the existence of God?
    I think getting them to commit might be better achieved by asking, Does God exist?

    Asking if they believe God exists allows the escape hatch of, “I personally don’t believe God exists but acknowledge that He might.”
  3. Standard member dj2becker
    rentrer à la maison
    28 May '18 08:59
    Originally posted by @romans1009
    I think getting them to commit might be better achieved by asking, Does God exist?

    Asking if they believe God exists allows the escape hatch of, “I personally don’t believe God exists but acknowledge that He might.”
    Good point, I edited the question.
  4. Standard member Romans1009
    Cretinous Mutterings
    28 May '18 09:11
    Maybe there’s a gap in my thinking on this, but I would have no problem saying pink unicorns don’t exist. Why is it so hard for some atheists in here to say God doesn’t exist? They claim there’s no evidence for God so why not own the position?

    Instead, they try to attach all kinds of qualifiers to their atheism. It’s as if, when they kick the bucket and meet their Maker, they want to be able to say, “Whoa, hold on there, God. I was never a real atheist. I was a weak atheist. In fact, I was mostly an agnostic atheist.”

    And then they expect God to reply, “Oh, Ok. Come on in.”

    According to the Bible, agnostics and atheists are in the same boat.
  5. Standard member vivify
    rain
    28 May '18 14:46
    I'm neither atheist nor agnostic. I haven't dismissed the possibility of, I'm just not convinced. I'm open to reasonable arguments.
  6. Standard member Romans1009
    Cretinous Mutterings
    28 May '18 17:56
    Originally posted by @vivify
    I'm neither atheist nor agnostic. I haven't dismissed the possibility of, I'm just not convinced. I'm open to reasonable arguments.
    Sounds like you’re agnostic.
  7. 28 May '18 20:29 / 3 edits
    Originally posted by @dj2becker
    Are there any real atheists left or are they all hiding behind agnosticism?

    If you were to ask someone whether they believed in the existence of God/god(s), they could either say yes (theist), no (atheist), or they don't know. (agnostic)

    Do we have any real atheists left that have the guts to truthfully answer this question: Does God exist?
    A person who says he is an agnostic on the basis of “lacking belief in God” is subject to constant scrutiny of his later pronouncements for evidence that he does actually believe there is no God. In fact, a person who comes to realize that God’s existence cannot be disproven, due to refinement by theists of the God concept*, has work to do to make sure his behavior is in line with a lack of belief, or he is bound to be revealed, even to other nontheists, for his “positive” or “strong” atheism.

    *A simple refinement being an appeal to mystery and faith as transcendent.
  8. 28 May '18 20:46 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by @romans1009
    Maybe there’s a gap in my thinking on this, but I would have no problem saying pink unicorns don’t exist. Why is it so hard for some atheists in here to say God doesn’t exist? They claim there’s no evidence for God so why not own the position?

    Instead, they try to attach all kinds of qualifiers to their atheism. It’s as if, when they kick the bucket a ...[text shortened]... y, “Oh, Ok. Come on in.”

    According to the Bible, agnostics and atheists are in the same boat.
    “According to the Bible, agnostics and atheists are in the same boat.”

    That’s right, put there by John 3:18. “Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed [read “he lacked belief”] in the name of the only Son.”
  9. Standard member wolfgang59
    Infidel
    29 May '18 04:21
    Originally posted by @dj2becker
    Are there any real atheists left or are they all hiding behind agnosticism?

    If you were to ask someone whether they believed in the existence of God/god(s), they could either say yes (theist), no (atheist), or they don't know. (agnostic)

    Do we have any real atheists left that have the guts to truthfully answer this question: Does God exist?
    If you were to ask someone whether they believed in the existence
    of God/god(s) they could either say yes (theist) or no (atheist).

    Get yourself a dictionary and lookup "agnostic".

    Most theists and theists are agnostic!
  10. Standard member Romans1009
    Cretinous Mutterings
    29 May '18 04:24 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by @wolfgang59
    If you were to ask someone whether they believed in the existence
    of God/god(s) they could either say yes (theist) or no (atheist).

    Get yourself a dictionary and lookup "agnostic".

    Most theists and theists are agnostic!
    You think most theists identify themselves with this view, which is the dictionary definition of agnostic?

    “a person who believes that nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of God or of anything beyond material phenomena; a person who claims neither faith nor disbelief in God.”

    You think most atheists identify themselves with that view?
  11. Standard member dj2becker
    rentrer à la maison
    29 May '18 07:11
    Originally posted by @vivify
    I'm neither atheist nor agnostic. I haven't dismissed the possibility of, I'm just not convinced. I'm open to reasonable arguments.
    So what would be the best word to describe your world view?
  12. Standard member wolfgang59
    Infidel
    30 May '18 04:16 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by @romans1009
    You think most theists identify themselves with this view, which is the dictionary definition of agnostic?

    “a person who believes that nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of God or of anything beyond material phenomena; .”

    You think most atheists identify themselves with that view?
    Most sane ones yes. Including most clergy.

    The second part of the definition you found
    a person who claims neither faith nor disbelief in God
    is rather archaic and non-sensical.
  13. Standard member Romans1009
    Cretinous Mutterings
    30 May '18 04:23 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by @wolfgang59
    Most sane ones yes. Including most clergy.

    The second part of the definition you found
    a person who claims neither faith nor disbelief in God
    is rather archaic and non-sensical.
    <<Most sane ones yes. Including most clergy.>>

    Really? Most clergy think the Bible doesn’t tell us anything about the existence and nature of God?

    Has a clergy member actually said that to you?
  14. Standard member wolfgang59
    Infidel
    30 May '18 08:35
    Originally posted by @romans1009
    <<Most sane ones yes. Including most clergy.>>

    Really? Most clergy think the Bible doesn’t tell us anything about the existence and nature of God?

    Has a clergy member actually said that to you?
    The Bible cannot tell us about the existence of god can it?
  15. Standard member Romans1009
    Cretinous Mutterings
    30 May '18 08:54
    Originally posted by @wolfgang59
    The Bible cannot tell us about the existence of god can it?
    Sure it can. The Bible is all about God.