Can the real atheists please stand up?

Originally posted by @moonbus
All people are born atheists in sense b). People must first be introduced to the concept of deity before they can render a decision, whether or not to believe that such beings exist or do not exist, in sense a).

Yes. Everyone is born an atheist. Some of us grow out of it.

Originally posted by @tom-wolsey
Yes. Everyone is born an atheist. Some of us grow out of it.

While obtaining and adhering to and communicating religious belief is undoubtedly a matter of personal growth for billions of people around the world, I don't think that it's psychologically correct to attribute a lack of religious belief to some kind of failure to grow or mature as a person.

Originally posted by @fmf
I don't think that it's psychologically correct to attribute a lack of religious belief to some kind of failure to grow or mature as a person.

So now atheism is just a "lack of religious belief?"

Well. I know a lot of spiritual people that would take exception to you stereotyping them as an atheist.

Originally posted by @tom-wolsey
So now atheism is just a "lack of religious belief?"

Yes, we already discussed this extensively. I know you don't agree. But why you seem surprised that this is my view, I'm not sure.

Originally posted by @tom-wolsey
Well. I know a lot of spiritual people that would take exception to you stereotyping them as an atheist.

I am a spiritual person [albeit perhaps not according to your definition of the word spiritual] but I am also an agnostic atheist. By "lack of religious belief", I meant 'not a theist', just in case that has caused any confusion.

I have apprehensions.
Although I was raised in the Christian faith...I still find the old rhetorical question compelling:

"If a loving God exists...why is there so much suffering and evil in the world?"

Originally posted by @wolfe63
I have apprehensions.
Although I was raised in the Christian faith...I still find the old rhetorical question compelling:

"If a loving God exists...why is there so much suffering and evil in the world?"

Because a lot of sinful people are in the world and sin affects the just as well as the unjust. If you want God to stop evil and suffering, He’d have to take away man’s free will because most evil and suffering is due to the actions of humans and not natural disasters (though the earth was cursed after the fall of man.)

Originally posted by @wolfe63
I have apprehensions.
Although I was raised in the Christian faith...I still find the old rhetorical question compelling:

"If a loving God exists...why is there so much suffering and evil in the world?"

"If a loving God exists...why is there so much suffering and evil in the world?"

It's an interesting question, for sure, and a perennial one on this forum. Having said that, it was not a question that contributed much to my own loss of Christian faith.

Originally posted by @vivify
Agnostics believe you can't ever be sure of God or not. I don't believe that.

And that is why the term 'agnostic atheist' is a bunch of convoluted mumbojumbo.

Originally posted by @vivify
Evidence-based.

If God (as depicted in the Bible, for arguments sake) were to exist, what evidence do you think would be sufficient to to warrant belief in His existence?

Originally posted by @dj2becker
If God (as depicted in the Bible, for arguments sake) were to exist, what evidence do you think would be sufficient to to warrant belief in His existence?

David Hume advised that when considering two possible optional miraculous (supernatural) explanations for events, to opt for the lesser miracle. When the existence of God as depicted in the Bible is a lesser miracle than all other proposed explanations of events, it would be time for the atheist to consider this option.

Originally posted by @dj2becker
If God (as depicted in the Bible, for arguments sake) were to exist, what evidence do you think would be sufficient to to warrant belief in His existence?

I have faith that science will eventually answer that.

Afterall, historically, it's been science that's forced religion to periodically redefine itself and it's beliefs. The transformative research of Galileo, Copernicus and Newton immediately come to mind.

I cannot think of a single instance when religion has made science change it's findings.

Originally posted by @tom-wolsey
Yes. Everyone is born an atheist. Some of us grow out of it.

FMF:
While obtaining and adhering to and communicating religious belief is undoubtedly a matter of personal growth for billions of people around the world, I don't think that it's psychologically correct to attribute a lack of religious belief to some kind of failure to grow or mature as a person.

Moonbus:
There are at least two variations of type B atheists: those who were born into it and stay that way, unconsciously, and those who grow back into it, conscious of the process. The term "atheist" is ambiguous; the reality is diverse.

Moreover, there are spiritual paths which do not require belief in deities. Buddhism, for example. This could be called non-theistic religion. There are many paths to spiritual growth and maturity.

Originally posted by @moonbus
The term "atheist" is ambiguous; the reality is diverse.

There are some contributors to this discussion, which is taking place across several concurrent threads, who are very keen to ignore or dismiss the reality and diversity of 'not being a theist'.

Originally posted by @wolfe63
I have faith that science will eventually answer that.

Afterall, historically, it's been science that's forced religion to periodically redefine itself and it's beliefs. The transformative research of Galileo, Copernicus and Newton immediately come to mind.

I cannot think of a single instance when religion has made science change it's findings.

I'm sure you would consider a complex spaceship as evidence of an intelligent designer. Why would you not consider a human cell which is equally if not more complex than a spaceship as evidence of an intelligent designer?